I think I've posted about Ryan taking twelve hundred dollars out of our account,I'm not positive it was him,but I'd bet my life on it. The bank is looking into it and then we will have to go down there and look at pictures,this is not the first time that he has done this.Anyway I said I wanted to prosecute and my s/o said that it's a felony and what kind of mother am I that would send her own son to prison.I told him,the kind of mother that has put up with his shit for 6 years and I'm tired of it.I'm pretty pissed off at my husband too. I have tried to come up with an alternative,but all I can think of is telling him to join the army or go to jail and I don't think they would take him. I'm really thinking of just saying fuck it and divorce him.

whoa.... talk to me hon....you know where to find me

You know I'm awfully fond of Ryan,J.Send him to me.

how old is ryan? if he's over 18 i say prosecute. someone who would steal from his mother [despite how desperate- he could at least ask if he needed to] requires strong measures. can't you just dismiss charges after all if you change your mind?

Shit, J, all I can say, you have the best titles for the threads you start. I don't think I can even touch this issue though, but my inclination is to prosecute, then work out a deal with his attorney so that he can avoid jail time in return for something you would prefer.

prosecute. $1200, that's fucking bullshit. We're not talking about the odd five bucks and change from your purse here. Of course i know nothing about your son, but i'm guesing that after stealing that much from your own mother, jail can't make you much worse. * A family friend refused to let his 17 year old daughter go out to a party a few years back. She retaliated by sneaking out through her window, going to the party, and returning home the next day with a cop and a lawyer saying he has sexually abused her on several occasions. It kept him in court for the better half of 4 years, not to mention costing him his job, his wife, the rest of his kids, and it killed his reputation in town. At the end of this shit, the girl finally admits she made it all up to get him back for not letting her go out that night. It cost him his entire life, not to mention all his money in legal fees, even though he was of course found innocent. The guy lives alone now in a crap appartment. It gets worse. Last year, guess who shows up at his door? it's the daughter, VERY pregnant, boyfriend in tow, asking for a place to crash, and some money please dad. And so he lets her stay. This guy is either a saint or just a fucking idiot. Now, i don't know shit about raising kids, but i'd like to believe that in that position, i'd have the good sence to grab the nearest aresol bottle + some matches, and teach daddy's little girl a thing or two about the bounderies of unconditional love. But that's just me ;) * not that i'm comparing, J. But as a result i've formed some strong feelings towards children who pull shit on their parents. That's fucking un-human.

won't the bank just prosecute anyway?

i'd be very torn. a felony will keep him from jobs. he'll learn crime really well in the stir. if it is your choice to prosecute, you can give him a chance to avoid that.

tell him he needs to go to treatment and show signs of trying to be determined by you, or you will press charges. then, follow through with it. he needs help.

The unasked question is "Why?" Any indication of drug addiction? If so, getting him help might be more important than $1200.

You know....you can only eat so much shit. I'm not going to pretend I know what the answer is, but whatever you've BEEN doing....it hasn't worked. Maybe Ryan just plain needs to be allowed to hit rock bottom---if nothing else helps. Maybe that's the only way he'll realize the consequences of his actions. I know you take a lot on the chin, J, and you're strong---but there comes a time when there's JUST NOTHING ELSE YOU CAN DO. It's out of your hands and the kid has no other alternative but to learn some hard lessons. And if you go for that divorce, hey---we can always go in for some crap land somewhere and party like beasts--- (Sorry----I know this is serious----I'm a horrible human being, is all)

J. my mom had to deal with my brother under almost the exact same circumstances. When he was 16, he was taking her checkbook, forging them and cashing them at the bank. She eventually went to a magistrate, I remember going with her, i was about 8 or so, and I remember the judge saying what my brother needed was a "good ass kicking" right or wrong, pug is somewhat right. She had him picked up in a dramatic way and he spent a weekend in juvy. I don't know if Ryan has been locked up before, but perhaps a weekend in juvy would do him right. If it's an addiciton to drugs...rehab is no doubt in order. Is it possible you could have him picked up...put in jail...and work an arrangement with the prosecutor...to not have him thrown in the slammer, but to perhaps have him in a rehab facility, a work camp, or some sort of probation. He needs to learn his actions will have ramifications, but perhaps you can limit them in such a ways as to ease the possible side effects that nate mentioned. And Im also wth pug on a desert freak out if you divorce. Try to stay on the up and up. I'm torn when i seen adolescent males behaving this way. My brother did. He had so emuch aggression. I saw him assault my mom...many times, my sister, and even me (though extremely apologetic). When my dad left my dad said to him "you're the man of the house now" and to a 13 year old, thats devastating. He never respected my mom thereafter. He was rampant, felt the world owed him everything. To this day, as a 30 something, he has a complex...he is always feeling judged, tends to react by simply closing a door. On one hand, I think males who behave like my brother, or Ryan...need their father to step in and perhaps, even literally take them toe to toe...their ego is rampant, and needs to be settled. They have lost touch with reality.On the other hand...i want to look for a more progressive way to deal with the situation. Has your husband been lackluster with his son over the years? Let him get away with shit? Does your son view you as the enforcer, or the easy going one?

Her son is an addict. I will repeat myself, he needs help. He does not need an ass kicking.

well of course he needs help...what kind of help is the question. and im not necessarily advocating an asskicking. im not abosutely informed on what exactly he is addicited to. If he's just a big pothead and x head....i think that addiciton is different than say a meth, coke or heroin addiction. if he's just a big pothead/x taker...it sounds like he needs discipline. Potheads are not known for stealing to get their next joint.

get him into rehab...fast. the sooner, the better. if anyone's stealing, especially from their mother, they need help.

my brother stole from my mother, but he didn't need rehab. he wasnt dealing with any addictions. what he needed was a father figure.

He needs something to shake him up a bit. If he needs help try to help him change. But there comes a time when you may have to turn your back on him and walk away- no matter how hard that may be. You have a life- even if that person is your own son- you need to think about how his actions are affecting yours.

Even w/intervention/rehab/etc....he's only going to get better if he WANTS to get better----and I don't know enough about his history to comment. After awhile, as heartbreaking as it is--if you've addressed the issue time and time again and just hit a wall----you may not be able to do anything but let him land in the WORST SITUATION POSSIBLE and figure out he has to pull back and get help in order to survive. One thing's for DAMN sure---he shouldn't be able to get into your bank account. I don't know jack about your family situation....do you feel as tho your husband has spent a long time playing Enabler to the kid? Just askin'.

He just turned 21 this last December,when he was 15 we sent him to rehab,he was on meth thanks to Amee who I had let move back home with her son after her divorce. It was pure hell,but Ryan has never hit me,which is more than I can say about the rest of my family.I called the cops on him several times and finally had him arrested for property damage after he punched a hole in the wall throwing one of his drug induced fits,he spent a month in juvy and I have no reason to think he did anything more than pot till now,he hasn't stole anything from me except for a bottle of vodka till now.My husband has always been the Disneyland dad and always put me down in front of our kids,if I tried to teach them chores,he would say you don't work,you do it.His own mother said it was his fault our kids were so fucked up.Six years ago we seperated over this same thing,I hated him then and had saved up eightteen hundred dollars through nineteen years just to get away,but blew it all after Amee moved back home on her legal fees.We went to counseling,she told him he fucked up too,he has really changed since then except for the kids and they think his first name is gravy,and his last name is train and I'm sick of it.I couldn't post yesterday cause I was babysitting and when Amee was leaving he gave her our gas card and told her to fill her car up.He gives them all money behind my back and trys to make me look cheap.All I know is when I never had anything I figured out how to work and when I did get anything,I appreciated it.Kids,you feed them,take care of them when there sick,dry their tears when they cry,and where does it get you?

this really upsets me j. ultimately, do whats best for you. if your sanity is at stake here, take care of yourself. he's 21? I would press charges and find the worst lawyer, so he hopefully gets the minimum. you can only do so much now since he's well over 18. you husband sounds (based on the bit of info here and in the past) ungrateful, selfish and a grown up version of Ryan. I don't want to say anything more as it might seem judgemental, but knowing you for nearly two years now, this really really upsets me. Maybe you need to step away for a bit. Take a vacation...(COME TO LA!)seriously... And this should go without saying, but if anyone is laying a hand on you, do NOT hesitate to call the police.

I actually did call the police,the last time he hit me,boy was he surprised,the state pressed charges and he knows I would not hesitate to do it again.Ryan started this after he hooked up with this bitch named Becky,they live together,I can't even pronounce it right, much less try to spell it,but when you need to have a blood test,thats what she does,it starts with a p,I think they are slamming heroin.Now he's talking about letting Amee,Jerry,and the baby move in with us.I wish I could get the hell away from them all,I know I'd sleep better.

you can if you want. you can do anything, and think nothing less.

Girl....get the hell out. Having seen my own family members deal with ugly, abusive situations I have a real hard time being objective about this----but literally----it sounds to me, all around, as if self-preservation needs to be the top order of your day. These kids are sucking you dry----you aren't able to put your foot down because you're being continually undermined. It's a no-win situation. Get the hell out.

My husband really did do a complete turn around when we almost got divorced,anything I asked for I got and I do mean anything,the one and one fith carot diamond ring,the really fine music system,a twelve carot aquamarine ring,we redecorated the house the way I always wanted it,I can have anything I want now.After I realized this I quit doing it cause I am frugal,but I did want to test the waters,so to me it just boils down to what is he going to do,if it's Ryan and we already know it is.He knows that if he doesn't do anything that I feel good about,I'm so outa here,and I get half of everything,and I deserve it.

I'm not offering any advice about your specific situation. I am only speaking here about what often helps me when faced with major issues: To see my way more clearly, I need to sit down in a quiet place away from it all with paper and pencil. (The public library has always worked for me. [My library even has a coffee shop.]) When dealing with emotionally-laden problems, it is almost impossible to think rationally. It is too easy to fixate on certain aspects or find your mind going around in circles. The very act of writing things down forces you to think more logically. Whether using a simple decision "T" or a complicated flow chart, putting your thoughts into words may make your best path more obvious to you. Oh, and I lied - I am going to offer specific advice: Ryan is no longer a kid and is no longer due to be cut any slack. The only way for him to learn accountability is to suffer consequences.

That is exactly how I feel about it Bobby,see we're all good.

J,Ryan is a good person.Have you established beyond doubt that it was him that took the money?This almost sounds more like a Heather type of activity.I know you're upset,but you don't want to do something that will have far reaching ramifications.A criminal record follows you through life.This could make him relatively unemployable.I think a really good scare tactic would be advisable.If you could set it up like he was going to jail/trial,it might scare him.Possibly an attorney could assist you with this.Ryan is really a good guy,and I don't want to see his life ruined.When you go to jail,you learn bad things.Criminal things.I know you're frustrated with him,but I would think very hard before I pressed charges on him.Another option might be to somewhat disown him.Let him know that you will not press charges,but nor will you ever assist him,should he ever find himself in trouble again.One of the things I always tell my kids is "Never make the mistake of calling me from jail",and I mean that sincerely.I would not,under any circumstance bail my spawn out of the pokey.And I would defy anyone in my family who did.I believe in consequences.Its a big tough world out there.And although it would probably be the hardest thing I ever did,I would not bail them out.I would much prefer my child to sit in jail for a few days or weeks,than have them end up in prison for years.Fortunately,I have never had to deal with this situation.But please think carefully,before you press charges on Ryan.And my offer still stands,you can send him to me.I could use the help with the birds.I can make it kinda like a little private prison camp.[now that I think of it,it really is kinda like a prison,living here in the south]Ha,then he'd see how good he had it back home.

unfortuantely J, when you almost divorced before and you got all those nice things....bare in mind, those were just THINGS....they don't really add up to anything, they just distracted you from what may really be wrong.

I know

Guess who moved in yesterday? I'm watching Orion,who I call Party Boy,I'm just posting now so I remember where this is,so I can come back and spill my very disturbed guts.

Orion?

yeah, you know, as in: So pleasant when the sails of the seas of orion gently slip No more need for God's sorrow, I just play it off legit

also,: Powder blue, powder blue The seventh sun of Orion with me too Oh powder blue, how do you do? Come walk with me now, powder blue

oh damn J..on the phone i thought you meant O'Ryan...liek you own son.

people are where they want to be just take care of yourself j

I only have a minute right now,but Amee and Jerry,and Orion are staying with me,and Heathers back home too.Ryan admitted taking the money and paid back $100.00 and is scared to death we will prosecute.It's always something at this zoo.

I am trying to scare Ryan into joining the army or going to jail,but he say's he will kill himself or leave the country,fuck him,he likes himself too much to do suicide and as for leaving the country,he couldn't even handle summer camp.I call Orion party boy but I'm just being sarcastic cause he's a pretty fussy little guy,but he sure is cute,even beautiful.I wouldn't have let Amee move back home if not for Jerry,he's a really sweet guy.

i'm inclined to say that Ryan seems to be the sort that should NOT join the army, get free weapons and learn to kill people, but of course that's just me.

I just have a minute,but type in Sir Jesus under the artist search here http://www.iuma.com then read comments about Sir Jesus,for some reason,he took the personal info about himself,but he's D.J.Dysfunction, I can't wait till he see's it the other two comments,are from his ex-girlfriends. That's not my real name or e-mail address.

You are right Whisper,I came home from the company party,to find out Ryan is driving around drunk,with a gun threatening to commit suicide and his plates have been stolen.How am I suppose to sleep? His sisters called 911,they are looking for him.

The little drama queen and his twisted girlfriend just make me sick,he called the next day like nothing happened,turns out it was a b.b gun,turns out he never left the apt. parking lot. White punks on dope.Now I find out that my husband has given Heather her last 2 paychecks(the deal was she was suppose to give them to him so he could pay off all her bills)and she scored some meth this weekend,any idiot could tell she was tweaking,but not prozac man.I hate them all,seriously.

J,my reservations are booked!

You better have a connection thru StLouis....

J - maybe you should go to therapy yourself. You sound like you're the only sane one in the gang but maybe you need to get some perspective and strategies for coping with this mess. A vacation is also a good idea, just get away. You need some space to figure out your next move. I'm so sorry to hear things are so crazy there but really you sound like you're holding together very well for someone so under the gun.

Don't worry Dinner Lady,I'll make sure J gets some good therapy while I'm there.I'll be having mine on the rocks.

Thanks Dinner Lady,I had therapy some time ago,I know now that I'm o.k.,but with everyone here,I definately need some space.I've gotten pretty good at self medication,but if my s/o doesn't grow some serious balls about this business with Ryan ,I really am thinking of bolting out of this mess.Czarina,Im soo glad this is going to work out,it'd be a shame if I got stuck paying, for him sawing away at me for 3 nights and I know we'll have a blast.At least Amee and Jerry help around the house and cook,I wish Heather would get a clue.

J,you have no idea how much I am looking forward to this.I have some serious thinking to do,and it will be best for me to be on neutral ground,away from distractions,to think rationally. Salud!

I need this too,but guess what? Like usual,I fucked up,I thought the place I rented was at Los Conchos and it's not,I'm on the shitty Miramar beach,I just realised that yesterday,I already sent in money orders so I guess I'm stuck there.This is the last place I want to be,it's where the youngins go and get all fucked up driving those A.T.V's and the beach is ugly.I guess we'll just drive to Los Conchos.This is the second time I've fucked up booking something on the internet,but it's my fault.

So what *was* the verdict on this question?

I think I'm married to a fool,still haven't heard from the bank about seeing pictures,prozac man probably gave them his work number,so I never see them,he does alot of things behind my back.I'm so tired of all their crap,I'm thinking when I go to Costa Rica this summer,I might ditch him at the airport on the way home.

That would be fun. They don't deserve you J

You are right Dinner Lady,and God knows I don't deserve the little bastards,but am very fond of spawn of spawn,Orion is getting fun now,and fat.I think I will be lost somewhere where they can't find me,by this time next year.I've been plotting.

I can't wait till Monday,I'm not even mad that my s/o is pulling a 12 hour shift sat.,I'll be at the Sea of Cortez Monday,and not at the shitty beach,right in town on Mimar beach,but two miles from the best beach,Los Conchos,where Czarina will be staying.I've decided I want to find something really tacky to buy,last time I bought a ceramic figure of a couple doing 69,then when I realized it was two Aztec men,I gave it to Brucifer,he keeps it on his patio and hides it when his mother comes down.

That lucky little bastard went to court the other day,they had no record of his first D.W.I. ,so they treated it as a first offense.They didn't charge him with being under the influence of drugs.So he just has to pay a fine and go to a M.A.D.D. class,and spend one night in jail,instead of the 30 days he so richly deserved.I found the shitting sea shell critter and as an added bonus A sea shell critter peeing too.

I got a shitting seashell critter,too.He fits in quite nicely with my other tacky treasures.I also lucked out and was able to acquire a truely hideous sea shell vaccaro,wearing a Mexican sombrero,and riding a real dried seahorse,and you can see his butt-crack.Its quite a sight.

I have a big problem with D.W.I. ...and it seems here in VA, everyone learns at age 16 how to do it. And I don't like that people get soooo many fucking chances. I'm not talking about trying to drive after two beers...I don't have a big problem with that..but.. well, let me get specific. I have this friend who drinks quite a bit. I don't like her drinking problem, but I also acknowledge that she's an adult, and that she creates and fixes her own problems. I'm not gonna end our friendship because of it..although I have seperated myself a little bit more because of it. Anyway...I guess my question is this... at what point do you step in and to what extent when you realize there's a problem..and when do you step back? I hold people responsible for their own decisions..but I've also seen her speed off in her car after 15 beers...and if something happened..I think I'd feel responsible, What the hell is a shitting seashell critter? Is that one of those little key ring things that you squeeze and a poop bubble pops out of?

Kalli, You MUST intervene!!! That is, if you have one iota of conscience. Do you or do you not care about the lives of potential innocent victims?

The seashell critter is like a human if we were made of shells,the comode is made of shells,the only thing not made of shells is it's eyes and a roll of toilet paper.