I met a girl last weekend. A friend of a friend. She was attractive and she looked like she was a bit older than me, but not much. So I end up getting together with her again a few days later, when I went rollerblading with Jen (the friend) We talked and got to know each other a little bit.. and it started the cogs turning in my head. The next day, I got her phone number and I asked her to go hiking with me the next day. We talked the entire time on the drive to the trailhead (about 1.5 hours) and talked through the whole hike, which was the better part of the day. A nd we talked the entire drive back. She even came by my house to meet my roomies. All in all, it was a very pleasant experience. We exchanged stories and got to know each other better - talked a lot about friends and family and growing up. She’s 30 ( 2 years older than me) single, teaches English at a local university - she’s been abroad several times and loves to travel. From what I learned that day, she posesses several qualities that I like. I called her the next evening to see if she was interested in going to a movie, but she begged off as being tired. We did chit-chat for about 10 min on the phone, though. So, what I’m wondering is...what step to take next. I’d like to get to know her more, but I don’t want to be too pushy or clingy. I’m thinking of asking her out to go rollerblading again, probably tomorrow evening - anything this weekend is out because I’m leaving on a 3-day hiking trip on Thursday. Do I try the rollerblading thing this week, or do I play it cool and wait until next week. I'd appreciated feedback from both sexes...

wait for her to call you. don't worry

her call me? Hmmm....

at the very least, back off for a little while.

Call and ask her to have your babies. No, I would wait till next week and then call...though I want to warn you, it's not looking good. If she was really interested, she would have made a counter offer when rejecting your movie offer. So play it casual and don't invest your entire emotional life savings in her.

Call her and ask if you can put it in her ass. Or...I don't know. Call and invite her to the movies or somethig again--maybe coffee instead, something in a well lit, clean area.

As much as I'd like to father some children with her, I'm gonna play it cool. Fuck, it just sucks being single in this town. Much more so than just being single in any old town. Okay, so being single sucks. I've done it for the last 10 years - coupled with celibacy, it's...well, it's something... fuck

i've got a question of my own concerning females. i was at the gym and this good looking girl i've seen in there a few times comes over by where i'm at and strikes up a conversation with her friend involving guys. their talking about some guy and not being physically attracted to him and how this other girl wants to set her up with this other guy and what not. basically this girl is discussing her availability within my earshot. i don't know if she had it on her mind and her friend just happened to be using a machine near mine or if she brought up that topic because i was nearby. any input would help. my confusion with females is legendary.

Firstly did you check their noses. Maybe you should have just joined in the conversation, from a male perspective. NAH to easy. Showing them some butt crack might work too. I digress. Next time you go there say "hi" - and take it from there.

although i lack experience in the picking up guys and gym arenas, i would say she was doing it on purpose. i wouldn't think around an exercise machine in a busy gym would be the kind of place i would discuss my availability unless i wanted someone to hear it.

Heh. female confusion? ooh... erm. nevermind. The mind of the woman is an un-understandable thing. Think I'd get in trouble for discussing it here. *peers around fearfully* heh. Damn. could use the help, too. *ponder*

On one hand, she seems to be very mature and she has her act together. So she'd be kinda out of my league since I'm still living like I was in college, except that I have a "real" job. On the other, we have a lot in common - we both drive old cars with high mileage, both like hiking/outdoorsy stuff. We got along great - I mean, the second time I've done something with her and we talk for 8-10 hours straight. Then again, I'm just a dumb guy - what do I know?

what to do about girls: kiss girls. everywhere. you don't sounds dumb to me. you seem thoughtful and nice.

You would get in major trouble. I'm have to walk over there and kick your ass. That's all there is to it. Girls are unfathomable. Just give up while you still can, wavydave.

if you are going to call again, call in a couple days, then ask her out to an event at some time in the near future, like a week ahead or so. That should give you an idea of what her interest level is. or not, I know fuck all about what women want, obviously, so maybe you'd better just ignore me.

You know, talk like this gets my goat. Women are no more unfathomable than men. It has nothing to do with gender and everything to do with personality. Some people are open-hearted and some people aren't. That's it. Chromosomes do not enter the picture.

*puts arm around spider* im with her

Between Mavis and Isolde, I'm consoled (hey! I rhymed!) I appreciated the other input as well. Isolde made me laugh out loud. I'd take an ass kicking, as long as there was some nibbling and belly-rubbing afterwards...and it was a woman...

gets my goat. i love that term.

I secretly wish Semillama and Rhiannon would fall in love and get married. just between you and me.

Gee you always make me laugh. I think they are cute too.

Oh, shut up.

Did I just miss something? The woman I marry is really going to have to not mind dirt tracked into the house every week. I have a great vacuum to make up for it.

Nah, they're just being girls. Girls! Bah! Who needs 'em? Speaking of which, I'm currently reading a book that has somehow managed to make me think much less ill of teenaged boys. It's called "Real Boys' Voices" by William S. Pollack. I recommend it to everyone.

all boys are evil.

I always thought so, but this book has made me see otherwise, God bless it. I never knew boys had such pressures.

I like evil boys.

is it like reviving ophelia? that was depressing. especially for a father of a young girl. i never finished it.

is it like reviving ophelia? that was depressing. especially for a father of a young girl. i never finished it.

wow, i double posted almost a half hour apart.

Reviving Ophelia was a stupid book. No offense, but it really was. I didn't see the point. I think the experiences she discussed happen to girl in any time period, and that she dealt with them poorly. Bleh. I fed the book to my cat.

This book is pretty uplifting. Boys (the ones in the book, at least) are a lot more sensitive than I thought. And they really love their mothers.

no offense taken, i didn't write it. i could see that her subject selection was limited by her profession. that it happens to girls throughout time doesn't make it ok. i don't want my daughter to have her 'spirit' snuffed out by society. it bothers me that this is a real possibility. in fact, it fucking pisses me off.

It's good to feel that way, I suppose. I hate to see people oppressed by society too, I just don't think books like that are an accurate reflection of what it's like to be an angsty teenage chick.

just call her and do never wait for something hello! I'm diamondboy , coming from croatia, and i'm 29 yo. belive me, it's in your hands what will you have and if you don't want to loose her, GO GO GO

You procastinate and you lose out. It is as simple as that. Why do men think women are so hard to understand? Granted, some women are complicated, and have too much shit to deal with to repeat the same sentence more than once so that someone, anyone, can understand them. Some reasons that I have a girlfriend instead of a boyfriend are because the guys never seem to want to listen to me. Of course, I still like guys, and their dicks have a lot more to do with this fact than their brains do. Don't get me wrong, I like people for their brains, but speaking from MY experiences, the guys dick and brain are the same thing (or very close to it) My girlfriend never says stupid insensitive shit, and she understands me more than any of the guys I have ever dated. Isolde, I don't know if shitty books should be in your cats diet. I am almost positive it will cause constipation. Good book:Cruddy....it is one I think every psychopathic killer in waiting should read.

This is cute: A man walking along a California beach was deep in prayer. All of a sudden he said out loud, "Lord grant me one wish." Suddenly the sky clouded above his head and in a booming voice the Lord said, "Because you have been faithful to me in all ways, I will grant you one wish" The man said, "Build a bridge to Hawaii, so I can drive over anytime I want to." The Lord said, "Your request is very materialistic. Think of the logistics of that kind of undertaking. The supports required to reach the bottom of the Pacific! The concrete and steel it would take! I can do it, but it is hard for me to justify your desire for worldly things. Take a little more time and think of another wish, a wish you think would honor and glorify me." The man thought about it for a long time. Finally he said, "Lord, I have been married and divorced four times. All of my wives said that I am uncaring and insensitive. I wish that I could understand women. I want to know how they feel inside, what they are thinking when they give me the silent treatment, why they cry, what they mean when they say "nothing" and how I can make a woman truly happy" After a few minutes God said, "You want two lanes or four on that bridge?"

Hey Wavy! Don't think you can just post and then walk away. I demand an update! Did ya call her? Are you making babies as I type?

yeah, i'm curious as well. are you kissing pals? or is she history?

No babies :( I called and left a message on her machine Sunday afternoon to see if she wanted to use an extra ticket to the John Hiatt show that night (along with Mother Hips and Young Dubliners) Sadly, she was about to leave on a camping trip with her mom. So, I'll wait another week.. or two... Soy.. un perdador... I'm a loser baby, so why don't you kill me?

From "The Modern Man's Guide to Modern Women" by Denis Boyles, New York: Harper Perennial, 1993 -- "Men (and women, for that matter) spend most of their first two or three decades like teens in a premarital mall, just hanging out, window-shopping, occasionally slipping something on, but not really buying. It's a shopping experience we have all shared. If you were one of the ones who left the mall married, then you know that what happened was psychedelic, man! Suddenly one day you started hallucinating signs that read 'Final days! Clearance sale!' and you grabbed something - anything - on the way out. "There are only a half-dozen things to consider when you decide to take a wife. Six. But skip just one, and you'll be doomed to repeat the other five. "1. Marry the most beautiful woman you can find. If you want to be happy for the rest of your life, never make an ugly woman your wife. There's nothing wrong with a little scenery around the house...[F]or us [men], it's the packaging that makes the sale -- and keeps us away from the return counter. If a woman has a dazzling personality or a spirituality that blinds you to her appearance, don't worry: you'll patch something together in your imagination that will keep her looking beautiful forever. "Meanwhile, don't get hoodwinked by movie-perfect women. We're a species obsessed with images of beauty. We worship beauty and often feel less than beautiful ourselves. So while we make women who happen to conform to the prevailing standard of beauty abstract objects of our desire, we also alienate them, make them into people unlike the rest of us. Since everybody does this to beautiful women, a beautiful woman can be isolated by her appearance and hence desperately lonely for a little civil company. The trite tip-off to an ugly blind date is the promise that she has a great personality, since we don't normally associate great personalities with pretty women (and men especially don't describe a woman in terms of her personality unless there's *nothing* good to say about the way she looks). For many beautiful women, appearance becomes a genuine burden, what with a world of men looking for just the right accent piece to set off the beach house or the Porsche. "On the other hand, attractive women who use their good looks as a replacement part for other important character qualities, like wit or kindness or competence, make expensive but very convenient Bic wives. They're disposable, but at least they know it. Like ball players, they have to get it while they can, because when the fat lady sings, it's all over, especially if they've become the fat lady" (93-94). "As we've seen, usually it works like this: a man meets a woman, and, based almost solely on her appearance (augmented sometimes by a decent personality or other marginal factors, like intelligence) he pursues her. His objective is usually quite limited. Maybe he just wants to see if she's a pleasant dinner companion, or maybe he's after uncomplicated sex. In any case, he doesn't see where a simple introduction might lead until he's finally at a point where *he realizes he can do nothing other than marry her*" (99, italics in original). "Look, no hard feelings here, but the best women aren't terribly sentimental about this marriage business. When a woman decides to marry, either she's been removed to a state of irrationality and will therefore marry the wrong man and so be made to suffer much distress, or she has already lived through the crazy parts of a love life and now browses for a husband with all the wild abandon of a spinster buying sensible shoes made to last" (109). "When men fall in love, they immediately begin assembling all the lost luggage of their youth, all the instincts for protecting the cave, maybe, and all the lessons about duty and fatherhood. Before the sheets are wrinkled, men are building the house of their dreams, at least figuratively speaking. Men quite simply expect a relationship to create a life for them -- or at least to infuse a life with some easily understood meaning. Men, therefore, often expect more from a relationship than a relationship can ever reasonably be expected to provide. They're space-walking, and when a romance ends, they're left drifting in darkness. "Women, on the other hand, are a little neater about all this; they've organized their emotional lives to accommodate a number of different attachments. Where men focus on only one context for love, women are busy creating pigeonholes for all the loves of their lives -- their father, their sister, Mel Gibson, their damn cat. A woman's love for you is one of a number of involvements, all of which are given more or less equal weight" (145). "When a woman accuses you of being insensitive, it means she's unhappy with her whole life -- not just the part you play in it -- and she's decided to make you the villain in the piece. She'll take all her problems, cram them in your pockets and push them down your shirt, then throw you out the door. "Space. This Einsteinian notion is woman's final frontier. If a woman asks for "space," it means she doesn't like you as much as you seem to like her. Run for it. Give her so much space she feels like John Glenn" (149). But remember, kids... "Any judgment of women...tends to be overly generalized. Many women will argue vehemently that none of this pertains to them, that women are no different from men, that they only problem with men and women working together is men. Women say men are jerks. Men say women aren't nice guys. But maybe women are right to a certain extent, at least about making sweeping claims. Generalizations really are unfair. So these are the women to whom this handy tract does not apply: *Margaret Thatcher *Jeane Kirkpatrick *Mother Theresa" (71-72). Bitter? Him?

christ that must have taken a long time to type.

There's bunches more, but I didn't want to tucker out your pretty head with all that reading.

shit. already tuckered. now what? Here's my tangent: Mother Hips rocks! I grew up watching them make it big.

I really enjoyed Mother Hips and Young Dubliners - Johh Hiatt... erm... He was a tad cheesey. Killer slide guitar (thanks to ... his guitarist) but I wasn't incredibly mipressed with John. Lots of middle-aged women were. Now I'm all excited because I get to see Cracker on August 10th - anyone want to join me in Salt Lake City?

wavy are you in slc? three of my closest friends live there.

Let me beat you to the punch, Satan: GIVE ME MY SEVERED HEAD BACK!!!!!!!!!!

GIVE ME MY SEVERED HEAD BACK!!!!!!!!!!

WOMEN ARE THE ROOT OF ALL EVIL... Don't take that personally, its not your fault your born that way. And I personally worship women, BUT... They are the root of all evil, they if the get organized have the capability of making a stratigic takeover of the world. But why do that when they already pretty much control it. I mean look at Hillary Clinton. The only thing I fear is that old Al Gore is going to make it into the white house (again) and well then Tipper will be in charge and that scares the living hell out of me. That will be worse than when Nancy Regan was in charge. Anyway, aside from my ramblings, men the only thing you have to realize about women is to figure them out is... THEY (women ) ARE THE ROOT OF ALL EVIL!!!

shut the fuck up

oh, don't take that PERSONALLY, by the way.

HAL, I thought I was the evil one. Of course Mavis is going to take it personally. Oh, and by the way I AM THE ROOT OF ALL EVIL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! GIVE ME MY SEVERED HEAD BACK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

"they if the get organized have the capability of making a stratigic takeover of the world" assuming that sentence made sense... they already do rule the world. don't doubt it.

I am the ROOT of EVIL, and don't forget that. But, I have lost my position as ruler of the world to women, that is true. THAT IS WHY I HAVE LOST MT HEAD! I am sure it was a woman who cut if off (I have heard that they are good at such things, ask Lorainna B.)

if bending my lover over the couch yesterday, watching Deep Throat and havving bloody murder screaming sex is cohorting with evil then so be it!!! she even got a me a beer afterwards.....then i made her dinner...... satan your schtick is old man shut your ass

Patrick you rule. i had a girlfriend once who would blow me while i drank beer and watched football. i miss her.

Gee Patrick, could you be a little less condesending?

no jay, my girl rules, im just along for the ride. eat a dick satan

Patrick, if you want me to eat your dick, you are in the wrong thread, HOMO.

You sound like a midget asshole I know...do you work at Wegmans and program TI calculator Games?

MIDGET ASSHOLE???? WHat the hell is that. My asshole is so tight you can't sqeeze a pea through it if that is what you mean

No, you bumbling idiot! I meant a very vertically challanged person who does exceptonally well in school and is a SUPREME perverted asshole and a jerk. And works 6 days a week at Wegmans. Never mind. Please go away. Thanks, in advance. (I LOVE how you can always find some way to relate anything to homosexuality and how it is bad and how you are so not a homosexual. Blah.)

note to satan "eat a dick" does not imply MY dick per se. It just means eat a dick. Whose dick is rather unimportant. Isnt summer school in session?

Mavis... to steer this topic back towards some common human decency... I live in Idaho Falls - 'bout 3.5 hours north of SLC. Do your friends like Cracker? Thought meeting them would be weird because that's like 3-4 degrees of separation. Think about it: You go to another city to meet the close friend(s) of a person that you know through some limited internet association. What the hell, I'll meet 'em if they'd be up for it - mabye we could go get coffee or a beer. I'd have to say coffee, because they don't water it down (like Utah's crappy 3.5% beer) and SLC has some cool coffee shops. or maybe not. Zephyr, Satan - you two play nice now :P

Haha! I will, I dunno about the other party. I've wanted to see the Great Salt Lake for a while. I probably won't.

Zephyr is the evil one here. :-)

Yes, I am, aren't I? No I'm not.

wavy one of my pals in slc is musical. i don't know how to describe it....sem, help me out here. i don't know if they like cracker. they tend to like less mainstream, more off the beaten path countryish alterna guitar stuff. do you play music?

Good lord, same people everywhere!

I used to play Tuba. And I was a damn good Tuba player. I noodle around on my roommate's guitars, but I'm not disciplined enough to actually learn more than a couple of coords. I can sing pretty well too - I'm a mid- to high-tenor and I can harmonize with just about anyone or anything. With a little practice, I could sight-read music again - I haven't done that for a few years, though. If your musical pals play gigs in the SLC area, lemme know - the Roomies and I are always looking for decent live music. We might even drive 3+ hours to get out of IF for a day. I never thought of Cracker as overly mainstream. They've had a few songs that got radio rotation, but I never hear 'em in this area - then again, the only 2 "rock" stations here suck. One is an "oldies" station that defines anything not of this decade as an oldie. The other is KBEAE (out of SLC) that's really into the angry alterna-rock that's so popular these days.

As for women cutting off the heads of men... Judith & Holofernes is a much, much better example. Oh wait, I get it... you're talking about the little head?! Sorry.

Now you get it!

wavy tuba? my last boyfriend was (is still) a tuba player. i'm a sucker for low brass..... have you ever heard any macedonian wedding music? like from the movie black cat white cat or underground? it is crazy and amazing. you should check it out. i mostly play percussion (african, reggae, and brazilian) and sing sometimes. i have a weird range. though. i can sing sort of high, and it sounds okay, but i sing better lower. i can sing tenor. my pal's name is GLADE. he plays at coffeeshops in slc a lot. he has a website with tour dates. he is sweet. we used to play music together a lot when we lived in the same town. i have a guitar, but it doesn't sound how i want it to....yet

I understand now why the loss of the little head wouldn't interfere with typing ability. What can I say, I'm slow.

I'd love to play Tuba again - it's just that they aren't the easiset (or cheapest) instrument to find in a pawn shop... But man it's fun. I doubt my roommate could work me into his muscial tinkerings - even though I've played him my Miles Davis album that has a jazz tuba player. I mean, he'd do it to be nice to me, but inside, he'd be laughing... or frustrated.. he's more into norwegian death-metal and other obscure music. He likes blues too, but it's still kinda hard to work a tuba into that... I have a couple of pennywhistles that I play around on, but there aren't any irish bands to hook up with. Mavis - aren't you in the Portland area? Funny you should pick that name. I uses Malaclypse as a screen name in a game I played online....

but my name *is* mavis. not my birth name, but still. even my mom calls me mavis now. yes. i am in portland. there are three tubas plus one sousaphone at my house. how far is idaho falls?

I doubt very much that I could talk my parents into calling me Malaclypse. It's a really cool-sounding name, but I'd have to start dying my hair black or something.. According to Yahoo's map site, it's 760+ miles from IF to Portland - about 12 hrs of driving.. That'd pretty much kill a weekend...

760 miles? wow....that seems far ....i know that it takes 12 hours to get from portland to slc---via pendleton/i 84...i drove there last november. malaclypse----that sounds nice. i like it when people go by names that they choose.... good night!

my friend Jerry lives in Salt Lake. he's sending me a present in the mail. It's a surprise. I think he's fab.

i was in a band that covered "low" by Cracker. we did it pretty good. i always loved that line about being with you girl was like being stoned. don't presently know any girls like that. would be nice though considering i'm trying to stay sober. if i could meet a girl who made me feel stoned well... what the fuck. can i bring this conversation around to poop somehow?

http://www.classyguydiscs.com/glade/ Glade is recommended for fans of singer/songwriters, especially if you dig how DiFranco plays her guitar (Glade is more subtle though). Malaclypse....Since ther is a Malaclypse the Younger, what does that make you? Malaclypse III? How do you handle that thing? I mean, theere was Pliny the Elder and Pliny the Younger, but no third Pliny, so nu?

Malaclypse. just that - or Mal for short. I don't go by that name much thought - I quit Asheron's Call - and that was my archer's name. Currently I'm Imaan, a female negroid-looking Erudite Magician in Everquest.

hey wavy i just remembered the club where glade plays---bob's tiki lounge

I can feel the love.

'tis groovy In all the talk of music and tubas, my initial topic has been overshadowed. Probably, being a mature, rational adult, I should just let this thread die. Joell (topic girl) is out of town for two weeks.

fuck being rational! wavy, what's up with the gal?

Nada

nothing? did she turn out to be a chump, unworthy of your sweet attention?