Perhaps the cruelest thing anyone can do is to refuse to accept an earnest apology for unintended harm.

or to laugh at an apology. this case calls for a sharp sword.

I disagree.

that is so far from the cruelest thing someone could do that i don't know what to say. except that- if that's the worst thing that ever happens to you, congratulations, you have a charmed life.

"if that's the worst thing that ever happens to you, congratulations, you have a charmed life." I don't think it's fair to say that. First of all, suffering is relative. An individual can make the judgment that event X was more painful for them than event Y, but one person can't compare their event X to someone else's. Know what I'm saying? Like I can't tell you I suffered more over my divorce than you suffered over yours, for example. How can I make that judgment? And you can't tell me that your grief over your mother's death was worse than my grief over my dog's death. You just can't. We don't know each other's hearts. Second of all, pain is pain. What does "an average human" care if your entire family was wiped out by a volcano and you're suffering because of it? He/she/it is still in pain on their own. And from the sound of things, they have a big conscience -- they feel guilty easily. So for them, feeling guilty and not being allowed forgiveness is a great suffering. Though, it is true that with presence of mind, you can see that someone else's forgiveness is not necessary to be able to forgive yourself. You apologized. You recognized that you did wrong and you made the effort to make up for it. That's all that matters. If they don't forgive you, it's on them. And they could have reasons for that besides cruelty.

yes, of course suffering is relative but do you really believe what you just said? death and divorce are such completely different things from "refusing to accept an earnest apology for unintended harm" that i don't understand the comparison i wasn't even comparing my reaction to an unaccepted apology to 'an average human's. it's just that "refusing to accept an earnest apology for unintended harm" cannot be categorized as CRUELTY. and if somehow it could, for it to be the cruelest thing anyone has ever done to you- i count you lucky.

Hmmm, you're right. I was thinking more about the suffering aspect than the cruelty aspect. "An average human" probably had a very recent experience with unforgiveness and so made that statement with a clouded perspective. For some reason I want to believe that more than the possibility that that's the worst cruelty they've ever come up against. Sir or madam human, if that is indeed the case, you really *are* lucky. Especially since -- as I said -- someone not forgiving someone else is usually not motivated by cruelty but because they haven't gotten over the hurt themselves. In which case, it's not even cruelty you're experiencing.

I define cruelty, btw, as hurting someone for the sake of hurting someone because you enjoy making people suffer.

Average human, are you talking about any events transpiring on these boards, perhaps? :-)

Much like beauty, cruelty is in the eye of the beholder.

What kind of a disagreement was that, Heather and Rhiannon?? There was no swearing, no name-calling, no slander of the other person's character. Worst of all - you were Listening to each other!!! So untypical of a Sorabji disagreement. I'm very dissapointed in you both.

Lucy?

Call for Lucy on line 1. Lucy?

That's very ironic. Because I wasn't thinking about Lucy.

antigone sees what i mean

Yep. It's a whiny white male thing, Gee. You wouldn't understand. ( Need I say :-)? )

I think I'm going to chose Antigone for a presentation I have to do in class. Someone else already chose the Medea and looking ahead at what we have to read Antigone looks like the easiest one. I haven't read it yet. I hope there's a good deal of whining involved.

Do you want some whine with your cheese?

Havarti and Brie, please.

Then we need some Ritz crackers,or some good bread.

Patrick, you and your little whiteboy buddies and your little camp follower can kiss my ostensibly Zionist ass. Leave me the fuck alone! Never refer to me in a post again! LEAVE ME THE FUCK ALONE YOU ASSHOLE. I CAN'T POST ANYTHING ANYWHERE ABOUT ANYTHING WITHOUT YOU OR YOUR BUDDIES COMING ON TO FLAME ME, WHETHER OR NOT I'VE SPOKEN TO YOU! I HAVEN'T EVEN POSTED ANYTHING ON THIS THREAD AND YOU AND YOUR LITTLE CAMP FOLLOWER ARE SNIPING AT ME. FUCK OFF!

(laughing)

why am i the one flamed here? I only mentionend what Antigone speculated. And what exactly did i do to deserve the aforementioned crap? I didn't say anything about you. The only thing i can think of that might explain your behavior is that antigone and i were right and that somehow embarrassess you and now your out swinging your battle ax..........AGAIN!

Don't talk to me.

humnas. can't live with 'em, can't seel their souls to alien forces...well, no, actually you can.

Actually, Patrick, you did mention Lucy. I didn't, though. I wasn't implying anything of that sort.

Anyway, if I wanted to say anything about Lucy it'd be this: almost any mention of her in a post provokes a response of anger and derision. Even people that support her are met with attacks. Lucy, you don't expect people to get pissed back at you for that? That could be what you want, though. Then you'd have grounds to say you're victimized. And when you meet so many discussions with anger eventually the anger is all that people see. So why don't we all just let Lucy's anger ride and not snipe back at her for it? Maybe then we can all calm down. Maybe.

Fuck that made me laugh. My boyfriend has gone missing.... presumed drunk.

well i interpreted your inquiry to the "human" as an implication, that was my assumption, and i know you didn't mention her name, i did, but thats it, just menetioend her name, and you are right, but if the fact that a mention of her name warrants the verbals assaults above.....well thats just fucking hilarious, so if she insists on pulling her pants down and painting the bullseye.......well......

Ratprick is out of line. He takes every opporfuckingtunity to snipe at me and I'm fucking sick of it. This is the second time he's done this shit to me and he's done it to Heather too, and doubtless to countless other people who he's argued with. Petty harassment is not the way to win an argument. I was fully justified in flaming the little turd. I deliberately went to a thread that I hadn't posted on in the hopes of finding some kind of respite from this constant hounding and I find that the nasty little shitbag has ruined this thread for me too. And instead of calling him on his fucking childish harassment, you all join in on the fun. Baaa-aaaa-aaa Baaa-aaaa-aaa Baaa-aaaa-aaa

Lucy, consider this possibility: so many people here are consistently criticizing your behavior because some of your actions are inflammatory. We're not sheep. We are reacting to you in a similar fashion because your actions provoke a predictable and consistent reaction in human beings: irritation. We all reacted the same way to Oatmeal Boy. Why shouldn't we react the same to you? "Ratprick" is a pretty funny name, tho.

"Lucy, consider this possibility: so many people here are consistently criticizing your behavior because some of your actions are inflammatory. We're not sheep. We are reacting to you in a similar fashion because your actions provoke a predictable and consistent reaction in human beings: irritation." take a hint Lucy Lucy, let me clue you in. We had differences way back when, you were quick to judge me and make conclusions about my life that you had no basis for, you did it to antigone, you did it to dave/agatha and you have done it to nate, you have proved this be a flaw time and time again. You have never recanted these errors in judgement on your part, in fact when we react, you only snap back with more rage, listen to agatha when she says no one is jumping on any bandwagon, listen to antigone when he says we are not sheep... and I have been in the position of reactionary for quite some time now. In our original scrap months ago i realized i could continue to butt heads with personal debate but what was the point, you are stubborn, pig headed and refuse to listen to anyone. So i have maintained the position of reacting to YOU ever since. I am not the aggressive one here Lucy, and your immaturity to realize where you may have fucked up is only digging your hole deeper. I admit I may have been unecessarily antagonistic, but no where near as viscious as you but to sit her and call me all of these names only makes you look like more of an ass. You need to listen to others, if not me, listen to the voice of reason of agatha, sem, antigone.....flame me all you want, i don't care, it doesn't effect me, it makes me laugh......the way i see it you have two options, you continue to call me names and such and make this place an utter bore for the others...or you can relax for a minute, realize where you may have come off wrong, and MOVE ON.

Firstly, DIE RATPRICK DIE. Secondly, Antigone, perhaps I wouldn't be so irritable if I weren't being hounded everywhere on the boards. Does it even occur to you that constant harassment might make a person just a smidge cranky? I'm fucking sick of this miserable bag of ordure hassling me everywhere I fucking go and I don't think that such behavior should be encouraged. And you are encouraging the filthy little turd. That bothers me, so please understand if I am less than perfectly polite when you do it.

Lucy, he is not encouraging me, jesus age christ, CHECK YOURSELF! I am trying to level with you and all you have to say is "die die" You being fucking ridiculous!

Lucy,if you remember I posted the Where,s Lucy thread,I missed you,I was just kidding most the time I,m never too serious,when I offered you some pills(though God knows I do think at this point you could use some) and you told me "fuck you".I have been flamed big time,I got over it.It just seems like you just start ripping for no good reason.

Seriously everyone is trying to level with you Lucy, I admitted I was antagonistic, but you have offered no leeway, you never have, and i suspect now won't be the time for fresh starts from you Lucy......so keep on keepin on and if you are going to flame, be funny about it for the sake of others around here...........

J, I hope you understand why I am testy. I came to a thread that I had never even been on specifically BECAUSE I needed a respite from that unspeakably vile little shithole's constant harassment, and found that this thread too had been turned into a "Lucy is ba-a-a-a-d" thread by the nasty little fuckhead. The reason nobody but shitboy hounds people all over the boards is becuase it's fucking rude and it really pisses people off. He does it consistently and I'm sick of it. I'm sorry if I'm a bit harsh with you, but I never ever want to read another post from that little needle dicked cat turd.

your being a child Lucy

Leave me the hell alone. Don't post to me. Don't post about me. Stop hounding me.

I think that's a good idea. Everybody (Patrick especially) should stop reacting to Lucy. So, this is my last post on the subject...

Antigone is just angry because he has a dick like GG Allin. If this Ad Hominem argument bothers you, stop helping shitboy try to drive me off of the boards.

Lucy, you are disturbed. Seek professional help now before you become institutionalized.

I've never seen GG Allin's dick erect, Lucy, so I can't speculate on the similarity. However, our flaccid penises do look to be of similar size, if that's what you're implying. If your intent was to emotionally effect me with those words you have not succeeded. So, were you trying to threaten me with that post? "If this Ad Hominem argument bothers you, stop helping shitboy try to drive me off of the boards." Sounds to me like you're threatening me with verbal harassment if I don't alter my behavior to your liking. Please correct me if I'm mistaken.

Actually I was quoting somebody in your little cadre who was too chickenshit to even use his real alias. Talk about cowardly. See Caspar. Fetidbeaver: Nobody asked you.

Wow. I just kind of aimlessly wandered onto this thread. It is getting a little out of control here--disocrd seems to reign. Lucy--I think you're overreacting to how people around here behave--I think that Antigone and Patrick are fully justified in being angry with you for not acting like the mature adule you are here. The fault does not lie with you alone in the beginning--I would agree with you in that they may have been a little harsh with you. But you have taken this out of control, and I think it is safe to say that the fault lies entirely with you now. Please, step back and cool off. I have enough fighting in my real life--I hardly need to see it here, among people who seemed to get along fairly well...and I think others would agree with me. You are entirely out of control. Please, step back and breathe. I don't think any of these people are Anti-Zionists, etc etc etc...and there's no need to play "Who's more disadvantaged" here. Oh--by the way--the Wretch says he's sorry for opressing you by being a white male, and that he will stop as soon as possible. Please forgive him for living. Thanks.

She leads me out down the seawall Stumbling drunk in the salty air Arm in arm up the steps to her house on the hill Looming nearer with every stair She says she can't wait for the morning As she falls through her bedrom door She says you'll never believe how the sun on the sea Really makes your spirit soar Then she spreads herself out on the floor Saying Pour me another Then lay me down We could almost be lovers Hell, there's no one else around All the pictures on the wall Mark the stations of her fall I want to decipher it all Before I give in (Captain Tractor) (totally unrelated. but I don't care.)

Lucy, if you mean that Patrick might be "The Man" from the Casper thread, it's doubtful, though possible. "The Man" posted from IP 158.59.40.203, which has no domain name associated with it, but is owned by the county of Arlington, VA. whois record Patrick posts often from 208.249.203.122 which is owned by a company called Liberation Publications based in Los Angeles, CA. whois record Patrick has also posted from 209.178.154.137, 209.178.190.35, and 209.178.190.197, all of which are owned by Earthlink in Pasadena, CA. whois record Granted, Patrick could have accessed the net through an ISP on the other side of the country from where he lives, but I don't think he'd go through the trouble just to post a reply to you. I can do an exhaustive search of the boards to find out if there's any other user's who's IP address are owned by the same organization as "The Man" if you'd like, Lucy. If you want to know the poster's true identity, that is.

Wow.ihat,s pretty cool you can do that.

You can too, if you like. Every post on this board has the originating IP address in the source code of the post. (It's right under the name, commented out...) Then go to http://swhois.net/ and enter the IP into one of the fields and it'll return you some useful info about the owners of the address.

Y'know... I've been trying to stay out of this somewhat, as my perspective will definately be colored by my personal life, but... My opinion has not changed. I think Lucy is clearly sensitive to persecution. Knowing this, Patrick has repeatedly rubbed salt in the wound and then sat back laughing (by his own account). This makes him a complete asshole in my book, and I will only refer to him as Ratprick henceforth. And, Ratprick, the "reasonable" stance you have just recently adopted is completely transparant. You really are, clearly, an asshole. Anyway, sorry to have to join in a flame war on a board to which I'm new, but it does seem to me that Lucy's close to the mark on her "mob mentality" statement. She is makes herself an easy target by responding to Ratprick's little snipe-war, and then gets hit by 3 or 4 others. *sigh* I agree that this should be let drop. That just ain't gonna happen with Ratprick dropping Lucy's name randomly, as was done on this thread, nor with a crowd of you bolstering Ratprick with further flame directed at Lucy. Fuck it. Drop it. Or not. You like pointless, endless flame wars??

i think people get really tired of the name calling, aggressiveness and inflammatory behavior it's not becoming in any way, laughing at one's childish behavior should serve as a mirror to said persons to see how silly they are being....my apporach didn't work.....i suspect nothing will

RATPISS, IF YOU WANTED A PEACEFUL RESOLUTION THEN YOU SHOULD HAVE STOPPED HOUNDING ME THE FIRST EIGHTEEN FUCKING TIMES I ASKED YOU. Oh, and Gee, I have been trying to get this point across to Nate: Being Jewish does not automatically make me a Zionist. I think that the Zionists are misguided, and that their anger is understandable, but not justifiable. My problem is that Nate is anti-any-Jewish-person. I am assuming by the complete lack of ANY questioning of the whiteboys' club's borderline STALKING behavior that it's okay to flame ANYTHING posted ANYWHERE by ANYONE who has ever pissed me off.

"--I would agree with you in that they may have been a little harsh with you" Firstly, I have a problem with your use of the term "they" when you have been, and continue to be an eager participant in this disgusting pecking party. Secondly, I have a problem with the term "harsh with you". Ratpiss started hounding me all over the boards, not after I flamed him, but after I ignored him because he was clearly frothing at the mouth. Why don't you go back and check the chronology yourself? You haven't, have you? Why? Because you are just doing what everybody else does, because everybody else is doing it. As a matter of fact, that's Lather's problem with you people. He was raised to be an individualist, and he detests sheep. He has spoken against me in the past, but right now, he knows a bleating mob when he sees one. As a matter of fact, I challenge every last one of you to look into what actually happened instead of just taking the mob's word for it. In conclusion, I would like to point out that the reason I am so defensive and pissed off is that I have spent the last week under constant attack from everyone on the boards.

DEAL WITH IT!!!!

Aren't you gone yet? You're too obviously stupid to even piss me off (I think you're a waste of skin, but I'm not really mad at you, as such).

gone???????...who said anything about going? I said I wasn't going to comment on an old subject again.....and I haven't.

'the man' also posted as eric isolde- i don't have any idea who you are, but to me your additions to the stuff come out as very out-of-place despite her unusual original defensiveness about her heritage- it doesn't seem to me that lucy is the one that needs to grow up

Vegetable: Well, one can only hope... Heather: Thank you. It seems to me that Isolde is somewhat insecure in her status, as she is rather new here (I think so anyway), and I suppose it was unrealistic of me to expect her to challenge majority opinion.

"Oh, and Gee, I have been trying to get this point across to Nate:" Were you talking to me, or just saying "gee" as in "whiz"? I'm not sure why you'd address that comment to me. I forget what I've said here.

whose woods these are I think I know his house is in the village, though

sorry, that was a test. I'll have been on these boards for a year next month. I've gotten heavily addicted. I can't not do it, almost everywhere I go. at the corner computer at work in kiev, ukraine. alone at a tapas bar in seville, spain. in my friend's apartment in paris, france. stoned at my aunt's house in the hague, holland. in tears in the ghost town of istanbul, turkey. wet and maudlin in seattle, washington. procrastinating at home in portland, oregon. I'm pretty sure this will be the last interesting year of my life. which is fine. I'm heading up for 30. and I always like the odd-numbered years best. so dulce et decorum est. I was just looking through old threads. it was fun to relive some of that boring shit I'm glad I could come here during the bad parts of this year, especially during the 20-hour work days in kiev winter and especially when I was fucking freaking out all alone crying and carrying on every day in istanbul after the earthquake. I really needed those hours of immediate message-and-response from people who weren't trying to sell me carpets or fuck with me. anyway, thanks.

Once, again----this is sorabji at it's best !!! and i love all of you people !!!!!

gee - you may want to read jean anouilh's 1940s interpretation of "antigone." I liked it when I was 17 because creon gives her the opportunity to go and marry his son and have kids and buy a house in the suburbs, but she's all like fuck you, I'd rather die, asshole. when I was a fall-quarter freshman in college I acted out a scene of it in french class with a very pretty grad student and was actually totally fucking mortified that we were going to sit close in front of the class and she, ismene, was going to stroke my, antigone's, hair while we did a dramatic reading in this other language. she wanted me to be antigone because she was taking the class pass/fail and I needed the bigger part for the better grade. god, I just remembered that. I was so embarrassed I thought I was going to die. and I also loved it.

i am drunk. and i would like to say that i will be 33 next month and every bad that could possibly happen to me - short of a violent death - has already happened to me. life is good.

Well, this may not be a good time to bring this up...but Droopy, I took your advice and started reading "The End of the Affair." I'm only about 1/3 into it (I started it this afternoon), but I must say I'm enjoying it so far. Thank you for the recommendation.

droop, i thought you were a lot older. your just a young punk like me.

your = you're. i must be channeling patrick.

Droopy where are you from? Currently America's Most Wanted is looking for Arthur Toerres -aka- Droopy, last seen in Brownsville Texas.....hhhmmm:o)

i'm from texas. but that wasn't me on a.m.w. really. my cousin soapy was once on cops:fort worth, though. i've got to change my handle on these boards. i notice there's already a mike posting here, so i can't use my own name. rhiannon - i don't know if 1/3 means you've hit sarah's diary excerpts. i'm glad you like the book. i notice they've made a movie out of it. roger ebert didn't like it, but he's an idiot. man, i drank alot last night.

Oh dear, I wasn't aware that Nate possessed such hatred for me. So much he sent me a cd. How could you? Sign -no, I said i would restrianing from pissing on the shite fire inthe caspar thread that wouldn't die, so i shall refrain and censor myself to try and keep the peace around here( something I do quite a bit, actually)

Sem, I DO consider that a snipe. Read his post and see for yourself... or you could just join the flock without thinking about it. He said some pretty heavy neo-Nazi shit, and then tried to backpedal in three directions at once, after a week of "Zionist Conspiracy" ranting. And Gee, sorry about that... it was intended for Isolde. You were probably going to be in there on some totally unrelated comment, which got cut and I never corrected it (or else I was having trouble with my screen refresh rates again and your name appeared to be on her post, which has happened before) Please forgive my carelessness.

Uh, I've read a lot of heavy neo-nutzi shit, and if nate's WERE neo-nazi, then they were damn tame. I thinkn they were just libertarian. I happen to not totally agree with some of his opinions about how teh world works and how it should, but I manage to keep my perspective. But that's just my opinion. I don't think this board is the type to keep neo-nazis around for very long. they have their own little hate filled worlds, and the open discussions around here would just muddle and confuse them. Thank "Bob". Those guys are actually pretty damn boring to talk to.

As bob as my witness...

i used to live in brownsville, texas and i guess i'm droopy, byt i'm not called droopy.......

Sem, do you even recognize what you are doing? I said "You are writing off what I said because you trust the flock too much" You said "What you are saying can't be true because the flock would have prevented it from happening." Look, the Internet is not a bastion of diverse opinions... It is becoming increasingly clear to me that the Internet is a place for affluent white males to get together and complain about how "oppressed" they are. That's because the majority of the people who have access to a computer, and the training to use one are relatively wealthy. And you have seen how the whiteboys use their numbers to silence anybody who mentions their privelege or calls them on their prejudices.

just for curisoity how many girls and boys are here.... off hand i think there are more girls, but lets see BOYS patrick sem ML antigone swine nate BK beaver markus Me sorabji droopy dave GIRLS agatha lucy RC Rhi moonit Gee J Crimson Kym Cyst Margret Isolade Czarina JusMicelf sister anyone i missed? not that this proves or disproves anything....

Heather = girl Isn't JusMiceElf a guy? That's what I've always thought. And Me... is a girl. But then, I used to think J was a guy when she first posted, so...

A.Die, Ratboy, Die. I asked you to leave me alone. You didn't. Don't bitch about getting flamed for it. B.The boys (following the example of Ratboy) have ENOUGH poeople that I can't post without getting harassed by somebody in your disgusting little cadre... and the girls don't seem to get involved... except for Heather, who has been in my shoes (i.e. being followed all over the boards by Ratpiss), and Isolde, who is an airhead.

Hey Lucy!!! When you want to change the subject of a thread you have to put your hand up and ask permission.

Hey, Dumbshit!!! Why don't you check why Ratboy posted that? Now, Sem, do you have a response to my charge that mob mentality and mindless faith in the flock, coupled with harassment tactics by the whiteboys' cadre are used to silence people who point out uncomfortable truths. E.G. Weeds/Notorious B.I.G... I interrupted Ratboy's pseudoliberal posturing to point out his less blatant racism, and was flamed by all the whiteboys on the board, who didn't want to hear it. Shit, everybody knows that Pink's bullshit doesn't fly... but what about more subtle forms of racism? Well, apparently, we don't talk about those.

ignore leaf

Ignored. btw...on another subject (with my hand up). Thank you.........why is it assumed I am a 'whiteboy'?

This is a fine example of how your little cadre silences people. I am attempting to have a discussion with somebody (Semillama) about herd mentality as seen here. You two saw one of my posts and descended on it, fulling the thread with your personal attacks and obscuring any actual dialog. This is EXACTLY the behavior I have been objecting to. This is EXACTLY why I have made repeated (and consistently ignored) requests that you not post to me at all. This is EXACTLY why I cannot discuss anything on these boards without having to CONSTANTLY defend myself from your disgusting little boys' club.

just for curisoity how many girls and boys are here.... off hand i think there are more girls, but lets see.. BOYS patrick sem ML antigone swine nate BK beaver markus Me sorabji droopy dave GIRLS agatha lucy RC Rhi moonit Gee J Crimson Kym Cyst Margret Isolade Czarina JusMicelf sister anyone i missed? not that this proves or disproves anything....

i was just curious if we have the "numbers" you say we do. I don't think we do. I didn't change the subject. I was actually adding to the conversation, or at least responding to something you said. How thats an attack is beyond me... I said what i said to leaf, just like many others have said to me AND YOU....there is no internal protocol or organized procedure involved. Leaf could be green and a transexual for all i care... I think the internet poses total freedom for those who can get on. I understand how minorities and the poor may not have equal opportunity, but in the realm of the education world, anyone who is in school most likely has access. Most school libraries have internet no, if not in the classrooms directly. But i think once you are on, you have total freedom, the internet has acted as a meeting grounds for many groups, organizations and factions who ordinarily would not have gotten together to exchange ideas, good or bad.

I think you've proved my point. This is clear, incontrovertable proof that you and your whiteboys are deliberately filibustering anywhere I post. Sem, please scroll up to my initial post before I got descended upon.

???whatever???? so it does seem though there are more girls than guys here......with the addition of heather and Me (sorry didn't mean to leave you off), that makes 17 women and 13 men, to my count anyway. and JusMicElf is a girl, at least thats what i think..... but AGAIN, this doesn't prove anything, just an observation

To Ratboy: What part of "fuck off" don't you understand? Semillama: Anti-Semitic attitudes are extremely common in California. Everybody I talk to here espouses the sort of Zionist Conspiracy bullshit Nate was putting forth. That is WHY I have arranged to spend the new year elsewhere. I think that you are convinced that anybody who gets the approval of the herd here is not a racist. I think Pink disproved that rather nicely, if crudely. You are being complacent and naive and you are begging the question... I am saying, "Nate and the whiteboys' brigade prove that this community is not immune to racists," and you are refuting it with "They can't be racists because this community is immune to them" (Please scroll up past Ratboy's filibuster to see my initial response to my post)

I'm not green I'm not a transsexual but I do know an arrogant self serving bitch when I see on.

I'm not green I'm not a transsexual but I do know an arrogant self serving bitch when I see one. Sorry about the duplicate post.

To Semillama: whoops. Make that "my initial response to your post)" To Ratboy: I answered your pathetic attempt to pretend you had a point the first goddamned time. I pointed out that your gang of whiteboy terrorists certainly has ENOUGH people to swarm somebody (especially when there are bimbos like Isolde who will jump on the bandwagon whenever they see a group of people ganging up on an individual. Initially posting your pathetic straw-man argument was just your usual harassment. After I responded, it became a blatant filibuster. Just to set the record straight.

lucy, you have the most fascist, nazi-istic personality on these boards. in spite of your wishes, i will post whatever i want, whenever i want, to whomever i want. i suspect most everyone else will do the same. you are not immune to criticism, especially not here. try wrapping your little mind around that concept.

jesusfuckingchrist (sorry Rhi, Gee or anyone else religious who takes offense)

MY FINAL POST: _____: There is a difference between "criticism" (a rebuttal of something I said in response to my actual post) and a filibuster (burying the thread in mindless flames that have nothing to do with anything that was said, in response to the fact that I have posted anything at all) The first is a normal part of discussion. The second is a tactic which you and your cohorts have used to silence me. As angry as it makes me that such repulsive tactics have been successful, you and your gang of whiteboys have driven me off of the boards, and as much as I mourn the loss of a discussion site which I used to enjoy, it is no longer worth it to deal with pointless harassment which can in no way be construed as intelligent criticism. Is that too complicated for you?

I'm not religious. I just respect the religious person's right to believe. But thanks for thinking of me.

it's really a shame because you seem to have lost perspective as what is a normal post or an addition to a conversation. You seem to have given me my motives, which are totally false, we could have peacefully coexisted but i don't think you were willing for two reasons.... 1) it seems anything that has my name on it is regarded as a harassment and 2)anyone who may seem to agree with me or at least share a similar opinion is seen as one of my cohorts. These are two illogical assesments and they have subsequently blinded you into seeing what really is. The failure on your part to see the difference between those two points seems to have pushed you off the boards, not anyone in particular. You seem to have declared a war with no visable opponent, for the motives you cite that are behind me and my posts just don't exist. and with no motive there is no case. So "tactics" were never a thought in my mind, but you seem to have produced them for me. In the end, i do regret you feel the need to leave DESPITE what I have said before. When you made your remark about the "numbers of whiteboys", I innocently and with a friendly disposition posted a working list of guys and girls around here. Thats not a flame and in fact i admitted that that information was utterly useless other than to show that "our numbers" simply don't exist. But again, you have taken anything i have said and somehow made it a flame...anyway.....I am sorry that you feel the need to leave, but at the same time i think you may have made your own bed when you wouldn't listen to anyone and refused to accept logical opinions, REGARDLESS of the source. have a good time wherever you go Lucy. (this sincere message has been brought to you free of hate, evil and contains no other agenda other than that which is stated)

ever see that bit in the Simpsons episdoe in which a tornado levels the Flanders' house...and the whole town is sitting there and there is a mention of the "happiest guy in springfield", and they all LOOK to this goofy guy with a huge smile and he says in salesman-like tone "no no no they are referring to him (pointing) BUT HEY THANKS FOR LOOKING (wink)!!" i suppose you had to see it to appreicate it

i've never had any problem understanding your words, lucy. connecting them to reality or truth is another matter. the only way i've been able to understand your point is by imagining myself on a 2 week meth binge and screaming "stop looking at me!" but they don't stop. they just keep looking. some are laughing, some are uncomfortable, some tell me to shut up, some shake their heads sadly, some even join in but they all keep looking. oh, why do they keep looking? "stop looking at me!" so, um. . .bye.

thank you for thinking of me........

The most recent posts by Lucy remind me so much of Oatmeal Boy. I wonder if she'd appreciate it if we posted our races for her, like OB wanted us to. In the end, though, there's no way to tell what anyone's race is over the web, really. Patrick and Cyst have put photos up of themselves. Several of us have only claimed to be of a certain race, others not at all. In every case there's no way to verify our racial heritage. Photos could be fakes. Claims can be easily faked, of course. Then there's the fact that making assumptions and stereotypes about us based on our race is the very definition of racisim... So, there's being illogical (placing racial labels on us) and there's being an asshole. (displaying racisim) Hence, Lucy is a illogical racist asshole. Exactly the kind of person she hates, strangely enough. No wonder she's in such a bad mood all of the time. The only reason I keep harping is that she hits on one of my pet peeves: she keeps arrogantly flaunting an attitude she claims to hate. It's like a priest piously fucking a choir boy.

DELUSION - A false belief brought about without appropriate external stimulation and inconsistent with the individual's own knowledge and experience. Seen most often in psychoses, in which patients cannot seperate delusion from reality. By responding/attempting to reason with Lucy we inadvertantly convince her that her delusion is real. Pease don't respond. Give Lucy time to grip reality. Lather, be careful, if you plan to stick with her then get her some help. If you don't plan to stick with her then my advice is.....WAIT UNTIL DARK, THEN MAKE A BRAKE FOR IT!!!!

Holy shit! I missed a lot. I didn't realize people were still calling me a nazi. An old farmer is having trouble getting his bull to breed with the cows and is lamenting this fact to a few of his friends down at the local grain silos.   One of them says, "You know, I used to have   the same trouble with my bull, but got it fixed really quick." "How did you get it fixed?" "Well I just dipped my finger in the cow's vagina and rubbed it all over the bull's nose and he got right after her." He goes home to the farm and decides to try it.  He grabs a cow, dips his fingers in the cow's vagina and rubs it all around the bull's nose. The bull gets a rip-roaring boner and jumps on the cow immediately. That night, he gets into bed with his wife and can't get the effect on the bull out of his mind.  As she lays sleeping, he dips his fingers into his wife's vagina and feeling that it's nice and wet, he rubs it all around his nose and gets a rip-roaring hard on.  He quickly shakes his wife awake and cries out loud,.... "Darling.  Look at THIS!!!" "She rolls over, turns on the light and says, "You mean you woke me up in the middle of the night just to show me that you have a nosebleed?"

As I said, there is a certain group of people who clutter up any thread in which a certain individual tries to post with meaningless garbage, preventing anything she says from being heard by anything but her. This tactic is known as a filibuster.

STOP HARRASSING ME. goddamnit Lucy. JUST LEAVE ME ALONE. i shaved my head yesterday. gearin' up for the new year. changes. there will be changes.

'scuse me. Looks like somebody's delusional. Your girlfriend should leave you. Did I name any names?

No, Lucy, but you are stalking Nate under an assumed name...

Hi Lucifer. Can't you come back without fighting?

JUST LEAVE ME ALONE. DON'T TALK TO ME. STOP HARASSING ME.

Excellent joke Nate..... thanks...it made my morning.....but then it got ruined :(

What ruined your morning, MapleLeaf? When ever my day is looking glum, I whistle a little happy tune and everything looks up!!

I am a bit irritated that I was trying to make a point on this thread, but it has been utterly (and on Ratboy's part, fairly obviously deliberately) buried in the flames from A PARTICULAR GROUP OF, NOT ALL OF (self-proclaimed) white males. So no, I'm not a racist. I am objecting to the actions of: PATRICK, ANTIGONE, _____, MAPLE LEAF, IGNORANTCUNT...err, I mean FETIDBEAVER and ISOLDE That is not all white males. That is the Whiteboys' Anti-Lucy Mafia. I am not taking exception to their race or gender, (in fact the stupid little whore that's following Ratboy around claims to be female) I am taking exception to their ACTIONS.

sunshine and lollipops..........aaannd rainbows everywhere ....grey skies are gonna clear up....PUT ON A HAPPY FACE just look to god my friend, that or tune into to a good hocky game. i can't wait till fox starts with hockey programming again, that and my hocky blokes finish filming sos we can get sauced and watch hockey at his cable equipped house i hear Phoenix and the Flyers are looking strong.

wow!!! hey lucy, can't you take hint that no one wants to converse with you regardless of what you are talking about. I thik folks are deliberately trying to avoid conflict, there is no conspiracy to sidetrack the conversation other than to avoid YOU.....jesus age christ, are you on meth again? seriously, you are acting way way way aggressive, and it's beyond annoying. seek help! by the way have some balls and use your real name if your gonna flame people. STOP HARRASSING EVERYONE STOP BEING SO AGGRESSIVE TRY ADDING TO CONVERSATION RATHER THAN KILLING IT BETTER YET GO BACK TO YOUR FUCKING HOLE by the way the previous past was made simultaneously to yours, i had not read yours when i said that nonsense, so don't start in with the i am sidetracking harrassing, following blah blah blah,OK?

loose cunt fur.

I would love to contribute to the conversation, but you scumbags won't LEAVE ME ALONE. HOW MANY FUCKING TIMES HAVE I ASKED YOU NEVER TO POST TO OR ABOUT ME AGAIN???? HOW FUCKING STUPID DO YOU HAVE TO BE NOT TO UNDERSTAND A REQUEST LIKE THAT??? KEEP YOUR SORRY WHITETRASH COKEHEAD ASS THE FUCK AWAY FROM ME!!!!!! JUST LEAVE ME ALONE!!!

Wow!!!!.what a rollercoaster ride!! I started to whistle a happy tune....and WHAM!!!! it happened again.....and then some civilized "hockey talk". I don't know what I would do if I had to wait for Fox to start broadcasting games. We have 3 networks (CBC, TSN and CTV Sportsnet) which broadcast games and we get a game virtually every night of the week. On Saturday night we get a doubleheader on the same network (CBC)...a Toronto Maple Leafs game and game from western Canada. Last night we got Toronto vs Florida (Leafs won!!!) and tonight Leafs vs TampaBay (Leafs should win). Wednesday we get Philly and New Jersey and then Thursday New Jersey in Toronto. Philly is doing OK but Phoenix remains suspect. A west coast team to watch out for is San Jose. They have a lot of experience on their team. Oh well...it wouldn't be long before Fox takes their stupid blue puck out of the closet.

AND LITTLE CANADIAN BITCHBOY TOO!!!

look you psycho fuck, you came on yesterday and just started in, no one was talking about you, no one said a god damned thing, you just started in, you are fucking nuts, calling me a coke head is silly, for i have explained to you numerous times it's something i do sporadically. seriously lucy are you on meth? You seem to display the random, volatile, paranoid nature of someone who is strung out. if so I suggest you leave the boards and get some help, you are no addition to things when you are like this. leaf, fox doesn't have the blue puck anymore, nor the highlighted puck, at least not here. how is dallas doing? Last i heard Buffalo had fallen apart, and Dallas was hurting when Modano went out early on. god i am so behind, i suppose i could get this info from yahoo but i like talking about it with someone rather than reading it. i wish evil on Anaheim like you wouldn't believe for fucking up Modano like they did, and Brett Hull.... actually i hear the Kings aren't doing so bad either

yea sharks. finally contenders.

leaf, you cn be my hockey bitchboy anytime, (wink wink) sailor!

LEAVE ME ALONE. HOW MANY TIMES TO I HAVE TO TELL YOU I AM NOT A ZIONIST. WHY WON'T YOU STOP HARASSING ME.

Let's just let Lucy blather on. She doesn't want us to post to her, so don't. That's what she wants, ya? Personally, I'm thinking of writing a little utility that deletes all of her posts from any sorabji message board I load in my browser, if I get the time...

THAT'S NOT ME YOU FUCKING HONKEY CRACKER TRASH. WHY WON'T YOU STOP HARASSING ME.

ANTIGONE YOU JUST GO TO HELL. YOU HEAR ME? GO STRAIGHT TO HELL! THOSE POSTS ARE NOT MINE! SOMEONE IS IMPERSONATING ME!

Those last 3 posts were indeed Tiny's. Check it yourself.

No more blue puck on Fox....the bastards... they must be reserving it for the border outlets so they can irritate the Canadian viewers. Canadian televsion is talking about putting a golden glow around the basketball so we can follow the game better. :) Dallas is doing much better lately....Modana is back and they just signed Kirk Muller as a free agent. Buffalo is dead meat as Hasek is injured and gone for the season....he is talking of coming out of retirement (he was going to retire at end of this season) and playing next year. Kings started strong but are trailing off now. I will find a better site than Yahoo for you...their hockey writers don't know hockey. Sailor???.....I get seasick. Antigone...I already have...is someone saying things about me?

See it,s like Sem said,it,s all in context.A cracker is a thing you can eat or a racial slur for a white person,or you can be crackers and people think you,re crazy.I like crackers and cheese,Ritz,brie,yummy.

actually she is right, and I just got an email from the same person, somewhere out of santa clara, CA, if you are referring to antione as "tiny" it's not him, it's someone out of stanford, or at least witha a server from stanford, they sent me an email to posing as a romainian immigrant wtf?

the imposter is...... wait a minute........ DAMN man cut it out, this is confusing i'm outta here, this thread anyway

hey, wait a second. according to the source it was... me?

i should kick your arse punk, but out tea time is still on, nothing repairs a grudge like acupulco gold

Oh bring it on....you drug abusing...son of a bith...

what's a bith?

How,d I get here?

Oh, wait a second. My mistake, that wasn't me. Shit. You crazy media owning freaks!

you know how when patrick gets going he drops letters? so it's "bitch", but he dropped the 'c'. at least, that's what i was going for. i mean, uh, yeha. FUCK YOU CANADIAN PISSCRACKER BITCH!

keep talking like that you fuck i'll open up a can o canadian whoop ass eh?

That last post wasn't me.....there is no canadian whoop ass left in the can.....will a carton do?

all you mugs have lost yer damn mind!

stop trying to fake the funk, you lame-assed imitatin' bitch. you people make me ill.

I'm just glad someone used the word 'honkey' as a put down. That warms the cockles.

you honkey too. warm THAT up in yer cockles, sista.

i don't mind lucy being on these boards whatsoever. and i don't mind conversing with her either. i don't think she's psychotic in any way. that is just a really lame and easy way to try to discredit someone when you can't understand where they're coming from. i mean, if you *really* care that much about the insults she's shooting around (or anyone else for that matter), you are apparently already suffering from critically low self esteem. you are simply projecting everything you hate about yourself onto someone else. everyone is a reflection of yourself. so try a little love. huh? love? whassat? hey, you know what? i've been meaning to tell you all about this. about a month ago, i picked up the newspaper, and read that prominent scientists (astrophysicists and quantum theorists, mostly) have formulated a new model of the universe. it's called String Theory and it evolved gradually since Einstein put forth relativity (an inspired but flawed concept whose mathematics crumble at the extremes of time and space). but String Theory math, to the wonder and dismay of many of its proponents, holds fast. you with me? ok, deep breath. String Theory essentially states that every component of energy and matter in the universe, or every quantum, are linked to every other component of energy and matter by strands of a dimensional force that binds literally everything in the universe to everything else. forget electrons and atoms and shit; that stuff is just matter, and matter is nothing more than a fleeting manifestation of energy. apart from the neo-spiritual beauty of Oneness, String Theory goes on to postulate that since everything is really One, there is no separation and that therefore there is no space. yep, that's right. every single "place" is everywhere else at once. oh, and while we're at it, remember that pesky little thing called time? well, forget it, because that doesn't exist either. at least not the way we perceive it (but i'm sure that's not much of a surprise to the lot of you). as much as every single place is everywhere else, each moment in time has existed at every other moment in time since the birth of the Universe. well, that was page one. just a synopsis. so... inasmuch as i believe in science and the usefulness of scientific theory, reality was somehow made into even more of an incomplete picture. but time? space? these are things i rely on having between my car and the one in front of me. these are the things by which most of the world measures their life. ok. still with me? naturally i wanted more. so i picked up a copy of a book called The Holographic Universe, by Michael Talbot, which deals with the now-pressing question: if it isn't what we perceive it to be, then what is it? Talbot and his scientific cohorts (too numerous to mention) theorize that the universe as we perceive it is a collision of omnipresent waveforms (waveforms = energy and matter) that cast a dimensional image sorta like a hologram. like a hologram, the image is not the thing itself, but a perception of the thing cast into light by the mere presence of our eyes, brain, and conscious awareness of it. these are enfolded orders and unfolded realities of an unseen whole that we, as mere frequency receptors, can only imagine. so i'm pretty much butchering Talbot's words; i'll type out this passage that i thought was pretty bitchin (p.50): Just as every portion of the hologram contains the image of the whole, every portion of the universe enfolds the whole. This means that if we knew how to access it we could find the Andromeda galaxy in the thumbnail of our left hand. We could also find Cleopatra meeting Caesar for the first time, for in principle the whole past and implications for the whole future are also enfolded in each small region of space and time. Every cell in our body enfolds the entire cosmos. So does every leaf and every raindrop... sound familiar? it's not that new agey hocus pocus crap, my friends. Wholeness, or Oneness, is an idea that Eastern faiths have grasped for years, though they may not have had the mathematical or astronomical acumen to prove it to the faithless, scientists, or skeptics. psychedelic pioneers (yay for lsd) have experienced it first-hand, but have always lacked the mainstream credibility to sell it to the masses (must have been the tie dye and bad haircuts). but now some of the most well-respected and brilliant scientists of our time are championing these ideas. ideas that definitely give the big Fuck You to Judeo-Christian dogma (which embraces notions of God as something separate and monarchal). so it appears that after a centuries-long game of tug-o-war, science and faith seem to have found a sliver of common ground. they've found it in a void, in the wholesale denial of everything we see, smell, hear, touch and taste. so much for scientific theory. this shit is somewhere between science, philosophy, and make believe. but as much as these revelations may ruffle notions of what Is, it at least gives momentum (among the people who care enough to think about this shit) toward a grander, more unified way of thinking about our world. toward an embrace of the All. and this, my friends, is why i was channeling jesus christ as supper the other night. and i certainly won't look at a pork chop the same ever again.

Semillama, you have formed many opinions with the help of the herd. I think you're ready to solo. Please scroll up and read my posts to you. Then ponder why you didn't read them earlier. Then ponder whether or not I maybe have a point about this forum not being as open as you think it is. To all of you: I read your little orgy of self-congratulation on "all having a kind word for me" It made me sick. You people turned on me like a pack of rabid dogs. The ONLY two people who were here during this whole disgusting episode who I consider to be above the level of dumb animals. are Heather (whose voice was ignored) and Sarah (who you SCUMBAGS called a fascist for expressing an opinion at variance with that of the majority) To the remainder: THIS IS NOT AN OPEN FORUM. NOT ONE OF YOU SAID SHIT TO THAT WASTE OF SKIN ABOUT LEAVING ME ALONE WHEN I ASKED HIM TO. NOT ONE OF YOU. NOT ONE OF YOU SAID SHIT TO HIM ABOUT FOLLOWING ME AROUND THE BOARDS. NOT ONE OF YOU. NOT ONE OF YOU SAID SHIT TO HIM ABOUT DRIVING ME OFF OF THE BOARDS. BUT EVERY LAST GODDAMNED ONE OF YOU WASTES OF OXYGEN HAD SOMETHING NASTY TO SAY TO ME WHEN I FLAMED HIM FOR... WELL, FOR FOLLOWING ME AROUND AND FLAMING ME. WELL FUCK YOU ALL!!!!!! I WILL NOT BE SILENCED!!! I AM PISSED OFF FOR A REASON, BUT YOU MORONS ARE ONLY CAPABLE OF EMPATHIZING WITH WHITE MALES!!!! ALL OF YOU PATHETIC PSEUDOLIBERAL BULLSHIT HERD ANIMALS SHOULD BE SHOT BEFORE YOU BREED.

damn swine!

hooray sarah!

Oh, Sarah, I just read your post. Thanks, that was really cool. The white trash and their cronies aside, Lather has a degree in physics and he says "Knowing physics is like being on acid all the time" The thing that particle physics (which is what he uses) teaches you abt. the Universe is that none of it is really there. Most people already know the part about(in the words of my High School physics teacher) "if an atom were the size of a baseball diamond, the nucleus would be a mosquito over 3rd base", but what most people don't get is that the mosquito isn't there either. Fundamental particles are vibrations in the fabric of the universe. It's sort of a rotation. Matter is made up of energy, and that's why E=MC^2 Lather explains it better, but he's out of town. I really want to conduct an experiment in which I feed someone acid and let Lather explain particle physics to him/her. Lather, btw, to IgnorantCunt, thinks you are an asshole and, despite your efforts, is NOT leaving me and you can't even begin to imagine how disgusted I am at you for even THINKING of trying to drive a wedge between us (and at the rest of you for letting that piece of SHIT go that far over the line without even COMMENTING) and I just want to let you know that your pathetic efforts will NEVER change what Lather and I have. Don't post to or about me again you piece of shit.

i'm lost.... who is IgnorantCunt again?

i was wondering the same thing man, i think it's you, remember i am ratprick

how could we forget?

"THIS IS NOT AN OPEN FORUM." And when did you become the 'keeper of the keys' and the 'maker of the rules'. This IS an open forum and we make our OWN personal rules....and I just broke one of mine.... I tried to ignore her....but the slime she spews got under my fingernails and I had to rid myself of some of it. And it was such a quiet week last week with normal civilized conversation without confrontation.

i find it incredibly funny that you felt the need to comment on the open forum thing. i mean, why is all that nonsense making you all so angry? it's so silly. saying that this place has no gatekeeper is redundant and obvious. no offense, kanuk. mmwah.

Jesus, you people are stupid. This is not an open forum because I can't say anything without you people taking over the thread and thus, effectively preventing what I'm saying from being heard. This tactic is known as a filibuster(See the second definition, you morons.) and is quite effective in silencing somebody online by burying their posts and by causing people to avoid a thread because it has turned into a flamewar. THAT is WHY I asked RATPRICK to stop posting to or about me altogether. I have asked him repeatedly to leave me alone so that I can have discussions with other people, but he is determined to prevent me from doing so, and brought the flamewar to this thread before I even got here. I came here seeking someplace where I COULD contribute to the discussion without harassment, and found that this thread had already been ruined for me. Scroll up and see FOR YOURSELVES. And NOT ONE of you fucking sheep said SHIT to him about it. That is why I asked him to leave me alone. THAT and the fact that it makes me sick that that whitetrash COKEHEAD piece of shit is wasting oxygen, let alone bandwidth and I don't want to discuss anything with him because he has demonstrated a pattern of following people around and harassing them wherever they post when they stop paying attention to him.

I thought i was a nazi or something. anyway, i'd just like to point out that i've avoided flaming lucy pretty much all along. i find it rather disturbing to be called a nazi, but lucy is free to feel how she wants. she's gotten a little extreme lately, so i had to start making fun of her. but really, in my history on sorabji.com, this has to be the longest i've avoided making fun of anyone who's been so extreme. that must say something, if not nothing. as far as never attacking patrick, et al... take a look back in the annals of sorabji.com history. i've been an asshole to just about every new person. and patrick is far from an exception. as far as not saying shit about having ratprick leave you alone, i basically witnessed your posts after anything he said, regardless of whether he was talking to or about you. i think you're both being little shits. but it's made me laugh. over and over again, day in and day out. anyone who gets so riled up over something so trivial. some people (swine, sarah,) are above it and some people walk in it. the rest of ya'll ARE it. tag.

hooray nate! have a nice day y'all. i'm going shopping.

As above, so below. fnord

"how could we forget?" c'mon sarah!

and i consider it a blessing nate, a rite of passage have been a victim of your verbal assualts, they have made me a stronger sorabjite. I like to think of you as the older brother around here, and well now, I am not so small and able to hit back but feel free to knock my boots anytime cocksucker!

Nate, the difference between Shithead and everybody else on the boards is... well, let me give you an example. I have an extremely low opinion of you because of your blatant anti-Semitism, and your pathetic backpedaling. However, this has not led me to follow you around and snipe at you unprovoked. I kept it on the thread it belonged on. NOT DOING SO IS INAPPROPRIATE and NOBODY has felt the need to communicate that to a certain piece of shit that shall remain nameless. You have said that I was "extreme" I think that you should scroll up and see what I'm reacting to before you make that judgement. I have "extreme"ly good reason. I came to this thread, SPECIFICALLY selecting a thread on which I had not previously posted in the hopes of finding someplace where I could post in peace, only to discover that Trick had shat all over it already. As for my reaction to "anything Patrick posted", yes, I got pissed off at the little fuck for posting to me AFTER I had specifically and REPEATEDLY asked him NOT TO POST TO ME. I even tried to let it drop, and the fuckers restarted it. I even warned them. I said "I am letting this drop against my better judgement, and I don't want to hear SHIT about retaliating if they restart it" They restarted it. I retaliated. Are you really surprised?

get over it.

Was I talking to you? Fuck off.

There is no such thing as an open forum. If this were a room with all of us talking in it you might feel you shouldn't say certain things. This is true often even with our closest friends Why is this board any different? Rules of society are rules of society. If you don't like the conversation leave, if you don't like the people leave. If you feel disallusioned that the people on this board didn't take care of you or agree with you sorry. People let each other down sometimes. They differ sometimes. If you can't handle that who is to blame? Get a grip on yourself. It's just a bunch of strangers in cyberspace talkin' shit.

Lucy, to think i post with you mind is an error on your part. You don't know what goes on in my mind and you are being a schmuck to think you can predict why i post ANYTHING. Don't flatter yourself to think I post to harrass you. According to you, if i post after you with no mention of you , you still call that harrassment. thats bullshit You reached a point a week ago when I couldn't even engage in the same conversation with others, WITH NO MENTION OR REFERENCE AT ALL about you and you responded sharply to me. It's a two way street, if i can't say, reference or post about you or to you, then neither should you, no one can expect ANYONE to sit back and have all this shit talked abou them without standing up for themselves. I have tried standing up AND sitting down, to no avail eitherway. Everything was fine until you came back yesterday, no tail between your legs, no humility, no regret for your shameful behavior, NOTHING. I tried ignoring you, i tried making no remarks to you or about you, yet somehow this is still viewed as harrassment. You won't let this go. I admitted long ago at the appropriate time a few of my posts were excessive. Why are you continuing this? as long as you do , you will continue to be a target by others, not because they are sheep, but becasue this behavior of yours is not socially accpetable regardless of ANY circumstances. and frankly I think most will agree, it's an an overall pain in the ass. You not doing anybody any good by continuing this. Now if you want to come back and converse, I can peacefully coesxist, but thats a two way street and so far you have proved to be a failure at that. I totally ignored you yestrday. I was talking to RC about Beck and you ASSumed i was doing it to harrass you. How dare you be so presumptions? Think what you like, but ask me if you want the facts. No one restarted anything until you showed up yesterday and started flaming all over again. Get it? YOU STARTED, you came here and opened up the can of worms again. IF you want to post, you are gonna have to deal with few things: one- I am not going away two- I will engage in conversations that you may be having with other people, NOT because i want to "harass" you, but because i may have an interest in the subject. DEAL WITH IT! three-despite what names you call me, you cannot break me down. You only make me stronger, you only make me laugh at your absurdity and childishness, you name calling does nothing to me and everything to you. now we can try again, as much as i *wish* you would go away, I am able to hang around here with you. Lets see if you can do it too. C'mon Lucy give this rest, as much entertainment as we are providing nate, this is getting old. And obivously your departure was pointless, so now that you are back, just let it go. You have hit a brick wall and the more you try to climb over the more you bruise and cut yourself, NOT ME! there, i have made my final peace with you. I will not address you, or speak about you again. I have tried it before and you still wouldn't leave me alone, or anyone else either...i am done with you, now it's your turn to prove your maturity and move on...ok? ok!

sorry that should be presumptuous

one more thing, my use of the word schmuck had nothing to do with your heritage, REALLY, i use the word all the time and I just recalled you were jewish, use "jerk" if you want. SERIOUSLY, this was coincidental

FUCK YOU@!!! THE SOONER YOU LEARN THAT I DON'T WANT YOU TO POST TO ME AT ALL FOR ANY REASON, THE SOONER THIS WILL END!!!

would you PLEASE actually read what i said "I will not address you, or speak about you again."

As for Xenophobia: A. Who the hell are you? B. I don't want them to agree with me, I want them to respond equally to equivalent behavior from a white male and somebody who is not a white male. I want them to allow dissidents to exist or to stop pretending to be individualists. As for that piece of shit whitetrash cokehead, I will continue to attack him AS LONG AS HE POSTS TO ME!!! This could have ended weeks ago if he had left me alone. I have asked him repeatedly to LEAVE ME ALONE!!! SCROLL UP AND SEE WHY I'M PISSED OFF. YOU GAVE ME NO PEACE!!! YOU GET NONE IN RETURN!!!!

you really should get over it.

Drop dead. Are you my new tail? Are you the new whiteboy who will follow me around everywhere I post? Fuck off. I DEMAND redress from these stupid sheep and I WILL get it because I KNOW that I am RIGHT. And your little snipes accomplish nothing, contribute nothing. Like most of what you post, they are a waste of bandwidth.

Patrick (look, I'm even using your alias), you have SAID several times that you will not post to me again. However, you have yet to actually STOP posting to me. And I already know that you have no integrity. FUCK OFF!!!

yes, i'm following you around. i like to see what your reply will be. go on, get over it

dave how it going? is the mrs. gone to NY? How are you faring all by yourself?

Hmmm. Is it really worth it, Lucifer?

Gee, I KNOW that I am RIGHT. I can NOT allow this BULLSHIT to go unchallenged. I guess it's just the way I am.

I am not willing to accept that this self-proclaimed bastion of free speech will allow someone to be so effectively and obviously deliberately silenced and then attack her for being pissed off about it. I DEMAND REDRESS AND WILL CONTINUE TO DO SO UNTIL SOMETHING FUCKING CHANGES. I WILL DO THIS BECAUSE THERE IS ABSOLUTELY ZERO QUESTION IN MY MIND THAT WHAT WAS DONE TO ME BY ALL OF THE PEOPLE ON THIS BOARD IS WRONG, WRONG, WRONG, WRONG, WRONG, AND I WILL NOT TOLERATE IT!!!!!

this is the most dismal little eruption i have ever seen

I detest people who are too chickenshit to even use their real alias. I know that I am right. I know that you people are wrong. There is NO question in my mind. Fuck you.

it's going all right. i've been coughing up some rather savory sputum, but otherwise it's all nice and quiet over here. aggie's in ny, actually she may be in new haven by now. the peacefulness of the house is nice for now but i'm sure i'll start missing them before too long. god damn, lucy. what a total idiot you've become. utterly fascinating. you should get yourself a show on public access. i know i'd be watching it every damn time.

have you ever seen colin's sleezy friends or francine dancer? I know they are locals but perhaps someone has thought to get tapes to other areas.

You contribute nothing. Die. Now, I will restate the post that was obliterated by the Whiteboy Mafia's filibuster: Semillama, please scroll up to it and ponder why you haven't read it. I think the reason why will make itself pretty clear. It was in regards to my opinion of Nate. Sem, do you even recognize what you are doing? I said "You are writing off what I said because you trust the flock too much" You said "What you are saying can't be true because the flock would have prevented it from happening." Look, the Internet is not a bastion of diverse opinions... It is becoming increasingly clear to me that the Internet is a place for affluent white males to get together and complain about how "oppressed" they are. That's because the majority of the people who have access to a computer, and the training to use one are relatively wealthy. And you have seen how the whiteboys use their numbers to silence anybody who mentions their privelege or calls them on their prejudices.

no, but here we have the mike hunt show and then there's goddess kring. oh, and the reverend bruce howard. i couldn't find a link for him.

i have hard about mike hunt on leykis

i,ve been wondering for quite awhile if Patrick and Lucy Phurre aren,t the same person

Lucy, you need a therapist and bad. The idea that you want to waste your time with these angry posts is incredibly insane. Do you think you are making a point? Everyone thinks you are a jerk and a loser. What is wrong with you? You are embarrassing and alienating yourself then freaking that no one is taking you seriously. Why would they? Seek professional help. Till then you'll be boring me.

i remember thinking that the goddess kring and sarah could be lost sisters who were separated at birth...

please do not fear your flesh.

Patrick...pleased to see you are fine. Have they determined the cause of the fire? I promised you yesterday a better site for up to date hockey news....and then my promise got lost as we spent most of the afternoon and evening avoiding shit and venom being thrown around and subsequently trying not to step in it. Here is the best site around.....it is updated every hour....and there are some neat video and audio clips... you will get to see and hear Don Cherry on Coach's Corner....he is a hockey icon in this country. The site is http://cbc.ca/sports/hockey

well, this time of year is vulnerable. It could have been anything. We haven't had rain since march and the santa ana winds that kick up off the high desert. A fire can spread in minutes. It got about 5 miles from my house, but the fireman did a great job from what I understand of containing it fast. Watching the helicopters hit it round after round and plane after plane is fascintaing....the smoke is pretty hefty though thanks for the hockey link

You're welcome....5 miles is close enough.... remember playing golf somewhere south of Anaheim while attending a conference and there were brush fires in the vicinty.. it was weird to be walking down a fairway and having an unattended brush fire in the rough about 150 yards away..... and the locals are carrying on as if it is nothing. Think the name of the course was Tustin Ranch Golf Club.

cybil, I don't have THAT much free time, or energy

> "And you thought your job was weird?" > >(ring ring) >TechSup: Hello undead technical support may I please have your name >and the date of your death? >Cust: Ummmm yes I am Vlad the Impaler and I am a GREAT AND MIGHTY VAMPIRE!!! TS: Can I please have your date of death sir as we have currently around >120 Vlad the Imaplers on file it is a fairly common name among the undead. > >Cust: Ummm yes uhhh well you see I haven't actually died yet I was just sort >of you know looking to see if someone would like you know bite me or if there >is some sort of trial > TS: Yes sir unfortunately we can not provide that service I would however point you towards you nearest foreboding castle or dark alley to >find a blood sucking fiend of your choice. > >Cust: Oh why thank you! (Click) > >(ring) > >TS: Hello undead technical support may I please have your name and the date >of your death? > >Cust: Ummmm Herman Carpinski, July 12 1876 > >TS: So what can I help you with? >Cust: I need to know how I deal with this whole rotting problem? >TS: Rotting? > >Cust: Yes pieces of me keep like falling off and there is this rather >horrible smell. > >TS: Ummmm sir were you killed by having and undead bite your neck and suck >your blood? > >Cust: No some guy danced a lot and blew dust into my face. > TS: Oh I see, sir you are not a vampire as it were you are what is known >as a zombie and while I can not really support that I can tell you that the >rotting smell is fairly normal. However I can give you the zombie support >line. > >(ring ring) > >TS: Hello undead technical support may I please have your name and the date >of your death? > >Cust: I AM VERY UPSET!!! > >TS: I understand sir becoming one of the walking undead blood-sucking fiends >of the world is a big step- > >Cust: NO that is not what I am talking about you (bleepity bleep bleep)! > >TS: Sir if you will please calm down perhaps I can help you? > >Cust: I want to speak to whoever is in charge!!! > TS: I can get you a manager sir but they will have to call you back in a >few hours are you sure there is nothing I can help you with? > >Cust: YEAH WHAT THE HELL IS WITH THIS DAMN SUN THING!!!! > >TS: Excuse me sir? A vulnerability to the sun is fairly standard to all >vampire types so that behavior is by design. > Cust: IT is not it says right here in this pamphlet I downloaded from >the internet that if I ingest the blood of 12 virgins on 12 consecutive nights and gouge out my own eyeballs which I have done mind you and I am >still vulnerable to the SUN so what gives? > >TS: Ummmm well sir as that is a different ummmm application of your powers >you probably want to talk to the people who wrote it or if it is some akin to >your particular type of vampire you may wish to speak to the person who >brought you across > >Cust: WHAT A LOAD OF CRAP YOU PEOPLE SUCK, AND NOT IN A GOOD WAY (CLICK) >You know I honestly hate calls like that. I mean what is with these people is >it my fault they don't read the fine print. I mean ok immortality is cool and >the nifty vampire powers are nifty but I mean they always just call me when >they can't deal with this crap and expect me to deal with this crap I mean >one sec got a call > >(ring ring) > >TS: Undead Techni- > Cust: YOU GOTTA HELP ME THERE IS SOME GUY WITH A CROSSBOW OUTSIDE AND HE >IS SCREAMING THINGS LIKE DIE FOUL FIEND!!! > >TS: Ok Sir please calm down >Cust: CALM DOWN HOW THE HECK DO I CALM DOWN? HE IS BATTERING DOWN THE DOOR! >AND HE SAOUNS PISSED!!! > >TS: Ok Sir are you vulnerable to holy symbols? > >Cust: Ummm no. I am a farquath vampire we don't do the holy symbol thing. > TS: AHHHH good I also see your kind of vampire has increased strength and speed and can take a lot of punishment ok is he through the door yet >and is there more than one of them? > >Cust: There are 3 of them! And they have crosses and one of them has a >crossbow. >TS: Hmmmm ok do you have a phone book? > >Cust: Yes, WHAT THE HELL GOOD IS A PHONE BOOK GOING TO DO?!?! > >TS: Sir I need you to remain calm if I am going to help you ok? > >Cust: Alright now what they are almost through the door! > >TS: tuck the phone book inside your jacket over your heart, when they come >though the door let them shoo you with the cross bow and then hit the one in >front as hard as you can. > >Cust Ok I'll try I am not very violence literate though. . . > >TS: That's ok just follow my instructions. . . > Cust: (sounds of crashing and muted thunk and a loud scream) Ok there >are two more now what? > >TS: Ok throw the one you hit as hard as you can at the second one and then >grab the third by the throat and lift him off the ground. > >Cust: (loud crashing and some moaning followed by some choking gurgling >noises.) Ok I have the head guy dangling now what? > >TS: Ok now look into his eyes and laugh maniacally. > >Cust: heh heh hehehe heh > >TS: Ummm try a more maniacal laugh kind like this MUHAHAHAHAHA > >Cust: Wow you scared me. Ok I'll try muhahahaha. How was that? > TS: Close enough now repeat after me. "YOU PITIFUL HUMAN INSECT DIE LIKE > THE CATTLE YOU ARE!!!" and now please squeeze as hard as you can. > Cust: (repeats statement and a cracking is heard from the phone) Nothing >is happening > >TS: Sir I mean squeeze with the hand you are holding him with. > Cust: OH!! Ok (wet cracking sound is heard) wow this isn't so hard maybe I will get the hang of this whole violence thing! THANKS so much for >your help!! > >TS: That's quite all right you have a good night now. > >(click) > >See now I kind of like those calls I got to help someone and you know that's >what this job is all about. Am I one of the undead? Heck no I don't care much >for the hours really I am just doing this for money while I study for my >Occult sciences degree then I can go out and make some real money as either >an undead admin or maybe a troubleshooter type because you know support is >great experience for that sort of thing cause it gets you to working with people and understanding things like I know tons about the undead vampire types and I heard we are going to start support werewolves and dippy magic users next, hey man they want >to train me I'm not going to complain I mean after all- > >(ring ring) > >TS: Undead technical support Can I have your name and the time of your death? > >Cust: Ummmm uh like is this where I call for like problems with being a >vampire? > >TS: Yes it is > >Cust: Ok so like do I have to drink blood that is kinda gross can't >it >just be cool aid or something? > >TS: No I'm sorry but blood is definitely a requirement. > >Cust: Oh well ummm ok. > >TS: Anything else I can help you with? > >Cust: Ummm yeah can I like catch aids and things from bad blood? > >TS: (hits mute button) MORON! (lets go of mute button) Sir your dead >ok you really don't have to worry about that. > >Cust: Oh ok how do I get the blood? >TS: Generally you bite people > >Cust: Oh ok well bye > >(click)

lucy: i wanna play horse billy: we have four people, we should play two on two. sammy: yeah, that would be cool. carey: two on two RAWKS! lucy: no, i wanna play horse. sammy: naw, c'mon! let's play two on two! lucy: fuck you guys i'm taking my ball home.

Threatening to take personal revenge on someone for a flamewar is WAY THE FUCK OUT OF BOUNDS!!!!

CYBERSTALKING IS A CRIME. FetidBeaver's behavior was morally out of line. Antigone's behavior is LEGALLY out of line. I have contacted a stalking victims' resource. Antigone, I want you to know that, if you think that your message was funny, you have made a GRAVE ERROR. I take cyberstalking very seriously, and I WILL take legal action against you if you persist.

Ok, I try and keep my word on things I state around here, but I have a soft heart, ok? Don't expect much more of these posts, this is an exception. Lucy (and everyone else who still gives a shit)- Do you remember how I said a while ago I didn't any want more direct participation in this? Last couple of days I have read through your posts, pretty much because they're every where and also I have a morbid sense of curiosity. Why not take up R. C. on her proposal to wipe the slate clean? Look, if you have issues with people here, take it to email. That goes for EVERYBODY. I think it's been well established that you will not be budged from your opinions. While I admire your willingness to stick to your guns, I think a little flexibility is more appropriate. Look, even R. C. (who has gone full on against the occasional aggro racist that tries to disrupt things around here) can't find the semitism with Nate's initial argument. I can see how it might sound that way, but like R.C., I have never read anything in any of his other posts that would support Nate being a bigot. I suspect he may be as big a softie as me. I think it's also been well established that Patrick will stand up for himself when he feels he's been wronged, just like you. That's good. However, I think that sometimes he posts without thinking through what he is saying ( although lately he has been catching himself re: schmuck post). And he's as guilty as you for not letting this thing go a long time ago. So, the two of you are caught in this Moebius strip of negativity. Where I think the problem comes in is the use of racial slurs on your part Lucy. You might want to think about why the term "whiteboy" can be and is just as derogatory as "nigger" in the context it is used. When you call me or Patrick or Antigone or Nate or whoever else a "whiteboy", it is equivalent to you calling R. C., Swine or Kymical a "nigger". The intent is the same. No matter how much we seem to shrug it off, it still hurts. And it was completely uncalled for. And that is why people started "ganging up on you", as you see it. What probably happened is a lot of folks here didn't approve of the (written) assault on another sorabjiite, and most thought your arguments didn't stand up to scrutiny (in science, this called being peer-reviewed). then I think a lot of people got riled by all the hate you spewed around. For the record, I don't approve of some of the things said against you, or in some of the supposed threats as well. I should have spoken about it earlier, and I admit my mistake. Now it may be time for you to admit you were too quick to judge certain people. Hell, just about everyone you percieved as your enemies have expressed concerned for your well being and even affection for you. I noted that you regarded that as an insincere ploy to feel superior. I'm sorry you feel that way. And you know what? If we can bring this back into the realm of civilized discourse and out of the screeching mudfest it has degenerated into, I think you will find that everybody will treat you with the respect you probably deserve, and will listen to your opinions. Here's some advice for future, um, incidents for lack of a better word, when you feel someone is expressing a bigoted viewpoint: Instead of attacking them with derogatory remarks, why not just say: "Hey, that last post sounded a little anti-(group). Could you explain what you meant by (remark)?" I find that not only does this clear up a lot of misconceptions, it's a lot better for getting people to examine themselves as well. It also works great when you are really confronting a bigot, because a lot of those folks are not used to such a pointed reasonable question. Most of them thrive on other peoples hate, and wither under intellect. But that's just my opinion. Ok, that's all I have to say on this. Let's all take a deep breath and bug swine about how late my tape is.

Yea Lucy,I thought I was all down for you,then you started calling me names,then the last time I posted,you started out with you were only replying to R.C.,and the rest of us could go to hell,then the next thread you said except for Sarah and Cyst,we could fuck ourselfs.So what,s a mother to do?

Happy X-Mas, you guys.

"Fetidbeaver's behavior was morally out of line" What the fuck is that all about? I've not been keeping up on the board lately, please explain what your statement is in reference to. Also remember that I have never claimed to be a moral person. One more thing, I'm so sick of listening to this Lucy crap that I hope someone does stalk you and shut you up one way or another. MERRY CHRISTMAS......

That was uncalled for.