it's frightening you know? it's not just a game when you realize you can't be without someone. i don't want it. i'm too good alone. god. oh. i'm also afraid of June-bugs. http://www.endless.org/~calliope

when it happens, you won't know what hit you. you don't have a choice about it. Unless of course you stay at home and hide yourself from the world. I said I would never get married, yet when my wife came along, it was a freight train outa control.

it shouldn't be that way. i want to decide who i love. jeff has a fucked up tooth, his hair flies in too many directions, he has a gay man's lisp, he's skinny and only sometimes looks good in a tie. why do i have to love someone like that so hard? i like his damn tooth, i like his damn hair, i've always been attracted to effeminate men, and who the hell needs a suit anyway? how'd you know? if a freight train was coming after me, i'm pretty sure i'd run. i just struggle with this intense need to be independent. it's so hard for me to imagine i could ever share this world (the one that revolves around me you know) with someone else. and yet, a part of me wants to. i hate admitting i have a soul. ;)

I dunno, to me it's black and white, you're in love, THATS IT. When I made the decision to commit to her, THAT WAS IT! Thats the thing about being with someone, you become to planets sharing asimilar orbit so to speak. I won't kidd you, my marriage has been the toughest, yet most rewarding thing I have ever done. Example, she was gone for a week...hard on me....she came back.....for somereason I was in a pissy mood at times this weekend and jerk.....she was confused...I apologized more than once....we had sex three times this weekend...the good kind too......the real kinky-I-ain't-seen-ya-in-a-week-slap-my-ass-fuck-mlike-there-is-no-tommorow ..kind it's hard but it pays off , and of course I am not just referring to the sex, thats is one of many pleasures and rewards............

you have a total choice over love. you can make yourself believe anything.

i think you're right. it's only love if you let it be. i just feel helpless.

well if there is anything preventing you from loving 100% it's not really love, or love worth committing to. it's a strange anomly, it's hard to explain. If you believe in a higher being then you can rationalize it that you were MEANT to be together. If you haver to make yourself believe, then it's not love. There was no convincing myself to propose.It's not like i had a choice as to whether or not I was in love with her. I just was for all the many reasons. She was my 5 star dinner so to speak, and yes I choose to eat it up, had I not, I would be unhappy. I guess what i am saying is don't fight it, we are social animals who need the love we get from significant others. My wife is a very very independent and strong minded person, and she is the happiest she has ever been. I think when you are faced with the real possibility AND you can see yourself happy with that possibility, it's not so frightening.

i'm just saying that, while everything waffles says can happen, it can also unhappen. you can set up your mind to believe (or unbelieve) anything. there is the feeling that waffles speaks of, which you cannot understand until it happens to you. from that point you feel like nothing could be stronger, nothing could be better, nothing could be more forever. and that's great, and sometimes it lasts. but it can be undone. you are what you believe you are.

Bart: "Hey Sensai, can I go to the bathroom" Sensai: "You can if you believe you can"

Nate's whole theory is so depressing, but it's pretty much what I believe. And I hate that. I miss the way I felt when I was younger and I thought you only fell in love once and the person you fell in love with would fall in love with you and everything would be Great. You'd feel wonderful. I thought it was like magic. Maybe it is for some people, but it never was for me. I think one time I Forced myself to fall in love with someone and didn't realize it until Much Much later. I don't know why I did it. It was love...I deffinatly was in love with the guy...but I made it happen. Is that still "real" love? I've decided that I don't want to fall in love again. I don't mind caring about people, and loving them, but the whole IN LOVE thing...it's just not for me. At this point, I think I'd only let it happen if I were in Paris. I'd do anything if I were in Paris. I think of Paris as a magic city, and it would be easy for me to believe in love and magic there.

oh you guys are deep. i've believed i was in love many times. i was convinced of it each time. i suppose i have this fantasy that i'm capable of loving and being loved. i don't want to think of all the mixed up things in between. i think what has happened over the past few years is that i've fallen in love with falling in love. the first few times you're with that "new somebody" always feels the best. i love discovering people. it's holding on to that thrill that i've constantly had a hard time doing. i've done it this time although everything rational is telling me no no no. >well if there is anything preventing you from >loving 100% it's not really love, or love worth >committing to. how true can this be? shouldn't we love ourselves before loving someone else? i'm leaving town because i know i *NEED* my degree. my largest passion in life, the thing everything else revolves around is my undying need to write and be a writer. in order to do this i need to have a degree. that has to come first. also, this man i've begun to love just divorced his wife of ten years. for me to throw myself on him and say "here i am...all yours..eat me up" is completely unfair no matter how much both of us may want that. if i love him, shouldn't i allow him to breath in between steps? we know what's good for eachother but we know what feels good and those two things contradict so strongly. it sounds so fucking cheesey but it's kinda like that "if you love something, let it go" thing. we're both doing it for eachother. he's letting me fly and acomplish what i KNOW i need to acomplish, and i'm letting him fly to discover what he is, alone. maybe though, maybe somehow if this is supposed to be as strong as i feel it is, we'll end up back in eachothers arms. but sometimes in the morning, it's close to unbearable allowing him to crawl out of my bed for work. funny how i expose myself to perfect strangers. waffles, you are one lucky lucky boy. you've figured something out that most of us might never learn. i envy you that something awful. that and your wife is damn sexy. i guess it's kinda like wanting to believe in fairy tales and actually believing in them. i wish i was more optimistic. i think paris would be a lovely place. maybe if the world existed there we might not be so pessimistic. it's late. god, i need sleep. http://www.endless.org/~calliope

"well if there is anything preventing you from loving 100% it's not really love, or love worth committing to." What I meant by this Kalliope was if there is one inkling of doubt, either about yourself or the other person, then it's impossible to commit 100%. Of course you should love yourself and take acare of yourself. Strangely enough, I am a rather selfish person at times and I dropped out of college and left my blokes in that crummy duplex to move in and be with her. Now, 5 years later, I am back in school and picking up where I left off. Like I said, in my case anyway, I was completely blindsided by L.U.V. i am flattered too!

i wish i had the ability to be blind sided. i have the desire to be so passionate, but then that logic thing starts screwing with me. oh dear. oh dear. oh dear.

If you lose yourself, your lover loses you too. If you change for your lover, you are no longer the person he/she fell in love with. Remember that. Of course, I'm the last person you should listen to on love anyway. My "I'll respect your space, you respect my space" philosophy leaves little room for the creation of shared space. My problem with relationships is my unwillingness to sacrifice my integrity, to allow myself to, as Nate said, make myself believe. (I am yet another adherent to that philosophy) I refuse to deliberately "look not with the eyes, but with the mind" I call 'em as I see 'em and I don't compromise for anyone. However, I don't think Nate's attitude towards love is depressing. I think "I'm with you because I want to be with you" is a much greater compliment than "I'm with you because some nebulous force out there somewhere made me" However, the burden of freedom makes everything heavier, and I have yet to find someone whom I can admit to choosing to be with, and still be able to live with myself. Fuckit, the healthy relationship is a myth. Only the young and naive can truly know what love is... Because the rest of us have enough experience with it to know better.

"Fuckit, the healthy relationship is a myth." this explains so much

That was my thought...

AHERRRM. hahahahahhahaha.

i wish things weren't so pessimistic. i'm young. i should still believe in this sort of shit. my friend ness at work is a lesbian. she told me to enjoy one night stands because that's all it'll end up being most of the time. if you find one that hangs on a little bit longer, enjoy that too. sooner or later everything goes sour. pretty depressing but she believes it. i hope i don't. ever seen opposite of sex? she says in the end, sex has a finality. it's true i think. maybe.

i'm afraid of June bugs too. don't forget that. i think it's the same sort of fear. ;)

Of course, I already told you, all feminists are unattractive, bitter man-haters.

i am a feminist and I am quite attractive

me too. i have great tits for a feminist. :)

so I have seen

oh my god. good lord, please don't let me say anything cruel right now. thanks lord.

praise jesus

ass

ear

penis

left testicle

ear fuck ass hole

uvula

nate drives a vuvla

im growing a second clitoris.

My tits are tangled!!!

sorry....vulva...they don't have that in my speak and spell

How do you follow "praise jesus" with "ass" ?? Every day it gets harder and harder to control the urge to jump through the computer screen and crack a few skulls. Curse you all for spoiling a very nice thread!!

what makes you think i was referring to that post?

I didn't say Refering to. I said Follow. I can imagin what you were refering too. I remain undaunted. What a very bad mood for me to be in tonight. Someone come bait me so I can yell at you.

Not to be on topic or anything, but here's something for you Kalli. Hubby and I were discussing this last night. We agree love is a word we use to explain the unexplainable. We say "I love you" at least three times a day or more. In the morning, sleepy-eyed and bad-breathed. After making sweet love, swaying in each other's company. At the conclusion of an arguement, even if we still think the other person is out of their ever lovin' mind. Every time we talk on the phone. Every time we leave the house. That man is the core of my being, and love is the pathetic little word I use to convey this to him. Love. unexplainable. Anger, lust, care, devotion, fear, enthrallment. I can explain those. Love is all that stuff rolled into one little word. And it means some different combinations of feelings to every person at different times of their lives.

Last night on CFMT, Lucy Zillio (sp) was talking about how "researchers" have decided that love only lasts 30 months - tops! She had a phone poll. "Do you agree that love only lasts 30 months?" 37% said yes. I'm told there was an artical in the paper about this a while back, but I missed it. Too bad. It sounds really interesting in a "stupid ridiculous people" kind of way. How could they POSSIBLE tell how long love lasts?? stupid freaking people.

Yo. If you think that's stupid... In my social psych class last year we learned about the cost-benefit theory of love. To wit, you love someone only if the cost of being in the relationship (computed by adding up how much effort you put into it) is less than or equal to the benefit of the relationship (computed by adding up how much effort your partner puts into it). The theory includes a mathematical formula for us guinea pigs to use to measure our current relationship. *tsk tsk* Will people never learn?

"How much do you love me?" "23.7"

And in the end,the love you make,is equal to the love you take........Whose your daddy?

Bullshit.

I trust Jean-Paul's response relates to the cost-benefit theory...if it is any consolation, the class did erupt in scorn and indignation, and the theory was effectually tossed out the window. I don't think we were even tested on it...a victory for true lovers everywhere.

Hah. I love you 34.6 but I have to subrtract 4 points because you fart in bed.

subtract even.

Hey Kalli! I represent that remark! : ) (I think hubby subtracts WAY more than that for that particular grevious sin)

How much does one adjust a score if you have a line of nipples running down the middle of your back?

Criminy! That sounds like someone trying to import economic theory into personal relationships. What fun. Honey, I did a cost/benefit analysis of our marriage, and it's just not working out. Charts, graphs...

Well, I'm pleased to report my relationship is 'humming' along nicely. As a matter of fact, we slept out in the tent the other night and I woke up to a stench. This was not just any stench...it was god awful, rotten, dead eskimo horrible. Jeff was crawling out of the tent and just looked at me sheepishly. I'm still sleeping with him after this intrusion. Does this constitute love?

No hon,you just have a strong stomach.

i am wondering as to what you are implying as to his "sheepish" look...Did he fart up the tent....was there a dead body nearby and he killed him/her? Did he go squirrel hunting earlier that morning and had his prize just outside the tent? Was there a pissed of skunk nearby? By the way the skunk population in LA is way outta control, something needs to be done about it. Ever hear an alley cat and a skunk go at it? The best part is, when hear the scrap, you can almost count on yer fingers 1..2...3....20.... skunk STENCH envelopes the neighborhood.......

Wow, that's really strong to be with him, if he thinks he can get away with this, I'd like to know what other bodily functions he will do. Pee in the corner, salivate on the windows..

Peeing in the corner is hadly the same thing as passing a wee bit 'o' gas in a tent. And what's wrong with a little drool?

Yeah, what's wrong with drooling, anyway?

Nothing,sometimes I suck my thumb:)

ima drooler......the orthodontist said when i was a kid i should have my anoids (spell?) taken out. however i think my mom was skeptical of his diagnosis. I have a hard time breathing through my nose at times. Nevermind the pollution in my nose, but i also have allergies..........i find it so sweet though when my cats drool on me, i usually try to direct the flow to a paper cut or some other flesh wound as to cleanse it.

they cut your nads off?

My dad had to have his anoids taken off once. Then he had to sit on a pillow that was shaped like a lifesaver.

Anoids are NOT in your butt, unless you have your head up your ass. I would also like to take this time to say.....FUCK THE FRENCH....and Paris

P.S. Just for clarity, Adenoids is the correct spelling. And FUCK THE FRENCH again.

I continue to love the french and wish you all horrible boughts of baldness in the most inappropriate places.

Fuck Jerry Lewis,it is Labor Day!!!

How much money would it take to get Jerry Lewis to say FUCK THE FRENCH! on tv?

Why don't you call up and ask?

It was a JOKE, Beav. Don't get all anoidal on us.

Hemroids

ummmm............... uhhhhhhh........uhhhhhhhhh....... hmmmmmm......... ok so today............. we caught the subway to Olvera St. the oldest market place of LA.....had margaritas and salsa.....bought bongos and morroccas........went back to silverlake...contemplated coke.......had a dinner party...our friend a gourmet chef...cooked chicken and fish...drank 20 year old port on top of the garage and played the new fun instruments...long live labor day or the lack there of.........took pictures...subway fast...had sex in the bathroom...cock....pussy look fast ..i have had too many...she kissed that girl and made her confused......i love her......love all

you got your nads cut off too? in a public bathroom? jesus christ would someone clarify this crap?

in turkey boys are circumcised when they are about 8 years old. and they have to dress up in a funny white satin outfit with a hat and a scepter and a sash that says "masallah" or something on it. but supposedly they get a lot of presents too.

Some guy from Turkey found me on ICQ. I'm getting a lot of that, lately, and I'm not sure why. My information says I'm 68. Do they like old folks in Turkey?

do you know if he was hanging out at an internet cafe in the sultanhamet district of istanbul? I probably know him.

What is ICQ?

I don't know, but I bet the first two letters stand for "internet" and "chat."

I seek you.

not public.....my friends house.....and my nads are happy and attached.......

speaking of nads.......onetime....my wife mentioned she was just looking/admiring my body when i was asleep.....and she paid special attention to my nether regions.....she noticed how my nads.....well... they sort of slowly churn...kinda like those cement trucks.........well...one day i wanted to see this for my self.......i laid perfectly still...and low and behold....they do churn like a cement truck...FASCINATING!!!!!!

icq. oh. clever. I was so wrong. so how does it work? people see that you're on and then bug you with a chat request? that sounds awful.

Waffles balls sound pretty wierd too,take some pictures Waffles,send some to janny.

it's true it's true....take note of your hubby's nads next time your in the sack, possibly when he is asleep, look down and you'll see em wokring away....

Icq is pretty awful. Especially when you get a surprise request by a guy who enjoys mutilating his dick, and he found you by doing a local search. I suggested he use a cheese grater.

that's why I call myself cyst. no chat requests, ever.

ICQ is alright. It's good for sending files, cuz it's a lot faster than e-mail. I'm invisible pretty well All The Time, but every now and then I think "I haven't talked to that person for a long time..." and go visible. That's when I get messages from strangers, but it's rare, and you can shuffle them to your ignore list and poof...problem gone. Right now I'm visible and waiting to see if this guy who's on there will send me a message, cuz it was one year ago today that we met and when I phoned him he said "phone me back around 11" cuz he was busy and when I phoned him back his line was busy so I left him a message saying "we met a year ago today! yay." and assumed if he had any sense at all he'd call me back, but noooo! So I'm working up a good anger. Insensitive clod.

whatever. I just don't see the appeal of spending a bunch of time writing messages to total strangers on the internet.

Not to piss you off Cyst,but thats kinda how Like I,m doing now.I like you,I like all of you,but we don,t really know each other,you know what I mean?

That was supposed to be sarcasm, right Cyst?

then what the heck are you doing Here? that guy was not a net person. I don't waste time getting angry at net people. he's a real life person who I traded icq numbers with. Off to bed, now.