I Do Not Love You.

let me count the ways........

I'm at one of those times when I think, "wow. maybe I really am a psycho bitch." I can't help being mean. I don't know why. I can be nice sometimes, but more and more I'm just all coy and catty and mean and awful. to strangers, to friends, to guys I have crushes on. I'm trying to figure someone out over email. it's really hard. I have no idea what this means. maybe you can help. (please don't complain that I'm asking; you don't have to.) as I've said before, I think, we exchanged email addresses at a party. he did not write to me. I got drunk one night a week and a half later and wrote him an email message saying that the party was dumb and that his email address was dumb so even though I thought he was cute, I didn't really care whether he wrote me back or not. yeah, what a charmer I am, I know. this is what he said back: "The party was not stupid. My e-mail address is simply an address. You should be nicer. I can tell you are a sweetheart. I'm not ignoring you. What's going on with you, what have you been up to this last week? Get back to me. However, should you choose to ignore me that's OK, because, although you are beautiful, charming, intelligent, and very sexy, you may have a fucked up attitude. P." ***I forgot what I wrote next, and then he wrote something like:*** "J, [...] I got my new sofa delivered today, so I'm excited about that, but the seat cushion is much firmer than I expected or wanted. A couple friends are coming over tonight to play guitar and hang out. Other than that, there is not much going on. It is a semi-blustery day and I think I'll just stay in and listen to music/play guitar/watch TV. What are you doing? P." ***I asked him some appropriate questions and then he wrote something like:*** "My new couch is grey. I live on [...]. I play both acoustic and electric guitar. You would make a great bass player...well...at least a great looking bass player. There is something I'm dying to ask/tell you but I cannot ask/tell over the wire. I'm not even sure I would ask/tell you anyway. [...] Well, write back soon. P." ***I told him he could ask/tell me anything he wanted, as long as it wasn't about two subjects that people have upset me by talking about recently. anyway, he misinterpreted what I said and got pissy and said:*** "Hey, [...] Good Lord. I hardly even like you. And I don't even know you. It must be tough being a girl, everyone telling you bullshit based on what you look like or who they think you are. Guys don't have to deal with that kind of crap so much. So did you like the movie? [...] write back, P." ***so I explained myself better and said something trite about the weather. and he said:*** "It's a splendid day out there. I'm on my way out in a minute. I don't think you are mean or whatever. You just have (had) this little act that seemed as though you liked toying/flirting and you were a bit condescending. But that's totally OK. It's fine to act silly sometimes. I do it a lot. I told you in the first letter that I felt you were a sweetheart and I meant it. I can tell. I could tell. Anyway, I think you are fun. [...] I will write more when I return home, but right now I have to run [...] You should write back though [...]. You should come by tonight. It would be nice to hang out a bit and talk, but I'm not into going "out" out tonight. What do you think? Let me know. P." ***later I explained this part of the exchange to my female friend k., and she said that it was totally disrespectful for him to ask me over to his apartment past 9 p.m. just to "hang out" and "talk." she said that this means all he wanted to do was fuck me. in any case, I was tired and said no. and this was the night that I was playing with my new borrowed scanner, so I told him I was scanning in pictures of my body parts and that I should send him some, then I did. I also asked him what he was reading.*** "Your pictures are arousing me... Yikes! [...] And OF COURSE I'm not reading a book. I'm looking at your pictures. Book later." ***at this point we were sending messages back and forth while we were both logged on. and I said something about how it would be nice to see him some time, that we could eat fruit, like star fruit maybe.*** "The photos are very nice. And no I've never had star fruit." ***I asked him again about what he was reading and if he had ever had lychees.*** Side shot is my fave. [then he listed his phone number] I'm reading "Consilience" It is not a novel. It's a book that puts forward the theory that there is a universal (in Plato terms) scientific language. I just finished two novels, both by Chuck what's-his-fuck who wrote Fight Club. One is Survivor and the other is L.A. Monsters. They were just OK. I don't know what lychees are. I looked the word up in an effort to learn, but, alas, it was not in the dictionary. Perhaps it was not spelled correctly. Anyway, I'm gonna couch up for a while. Thanks for all the communication. It's fun. You really should not be so lazy, and come by and visit. Like it would really wear you out. P." *** ok, then the next day I called him and of course was a total bitch. like in grade school when I had a crush on a guy, I would just make the most withering, awful remarks. like, I don't even know this guy, and I criticized his sleeping habits, his sheets, his current employment status, god, everything. christ. I am such an idiot. anyway. so he said he wasn't doing anything that night and that I should call him if anything was going on. I ended up emailing him and asking him if he wanted to go shoot pool with me and my friends, and he sent a reply saying that he was sorry, he had remembered about a "PRIOR COMMITMENT" (capital letters mine). and he hoped I had a good time with my friends. whatever. "prior commitment"??? those are total blow-off words. not that I don't deserve to be blown off after being such a bitch. but anyway. my question is, how salvageable is this? my male friend a. says I shouldn't even bother because this guy is so attractive that he must be rejecting chicks all the time. my female friends have said I should never, ever just go to some random guy's apartment to hang out. that the guy should make an effort. I'm sure they're right. it's possible my bitchiness has made him defensive. anyway, I sent him back a message saying that I did have a really nice time with my friends. he hasn't written me back. but, wait. why do I care? I only care because he's been both encouraging and discouraging. I should just forget it, this is dumb. so dumb.

now that I actually look back at what was written, I see that he first asked me to come by later that day (at 8 or 9) at 1:30 in the afternoon. so it wasn't like he just asked me to come over at that moment, at night. I hope this is some sort of lesson to me. I should stop being weird.

i have lost all patience with you, cyst.

You should probably take note of those guys who don't lose patience with you Cyst. they are probably worth letting down some of your defenses for. Or, you could embark on an extended period of self-examination on why you seem to feel the need to push away people you appear to want to spend time with. I think that once you break through that barrier, you will be much happier.

or maybe you should just stick to getting naked. that seems to work for you.

Or maybe you should ask yourself why you insist on creating your own problems.

ok. I am really going to try to stop being weird. some of my friends are good enough to try to counsel me. friend a. says that being my friend is like being in an after-school special called "there's something about j." at the end of the program, you find out that the main character is a heroin addict or is sexually abused or a teenage prostitute or all three, except in real life, the end of the show never comes, so you never know what's going on. friend w. says that I talk like mae west, everything I saw sounds like some sort of sexual advance or challenge, even when I'm just asking for a glass of water. he says that I'm one of the very few women he's known who seem more psycho than they actually are. no condescending, no coy, no bitchy. damn, this is really hard. but I'm going to try. friend w. says I should email the guy again, but my female friends advise against this. I have decided that multiple attempts at contact while he is ignoring me would definitely be psycho behavior, so I'm not going to do anything for now. really, I'm a nice girl, though. I just act dumb sometimes. sorry you didn't like the photos, swine, but it's good that you're mean to me. I need more negative reinforcement or something, I think.

cyst, just be real. real is good and feels good when interacting with others. it will be refreshing for you, i promise. the men you attract probably all suck because you are playing games and objectifying yourself, thus making yourself attractive to the type of men that like that sort of shit. there are a lot of nice men out there that you can be honest with. they are always my favorite kind of men. i hope this doesn't sound mean, but it seems as though you create lots of problems by misrepresenting yourself. if you didn't seem like a cool person underneath it all, i probably wouldn't even bother telling you this. here's another tip- hold off on showing the men the seductive photos until after you have gone on a few dates. this sets you up in a specific frame of reality that i don't think is healthy for you. then again, i can't relate to that kind of sexual interplay, so maybe i just don't understand. i don't know if any of this message makes any sense at all.

cyst, maybe you're just playing with how much you can get away with. you said that you didn't always look like you do now, are you experimenting with the boundaries of how people see you? my guess is that things will change when the time comes. don't stress.

being fucked up is more interesting than being a healthy, well-adjusted. it certainly makes for more outrageous or dramatic life experiences. but drama only gets you so far. eventually it becomes tedious and boring. if you're eventually going to be tedious and boring, you might as well be happy and healthy instead of fucked-up. ok, so being healthy and well-adjusted makes you less intriguing but also less annoying and more happy. well, that's what they tell me, anyway.

btw, when i drink iced coffee, my reflection in the bottom of the light blue mug magnifies my wrinkles. just another convincing reason to give up coffee.

"God help you if you are an ugly girl, 'course too pretty is also your doom. Everyone harbors a secret hatred for the prettiest girl in the room." -- Ani Difranco

I used to weigh 40 pounds more than I do now. I used to be really shy. I used to have a boyfriend and didn't flirt with guys. at some point I decided not to be shy anymore and to pretend like I was really attractive. to see if I could make other people believe it. to not be afraid to wear out outfits I used to only giggle at in the dressing room. to talk to whoever I wanted whenever I wanted with the assumption that they would want to talk back. then I guess I found out that it worked, to a certain extent. except now I am having a hard time believing that these guys are really more interested in what I look like than who I am. that who I am could possibly be a drawback. except I'm not acting like who I am. my roommate witnessed an interaction with a man who's into me, and she later told me she couldn't fucking believe the things I was saying to him. she said it wasn't me at all, that she'd never seen me act so coy before, and she couldn't believe that it actually worked. but it's not really working. I mean, it gets me stuff, but stuff is boring. these fawning guys are nice to have around, but they don't genuinely interest me. I think I'm just going through the high school drama queen phase late in life. I need to outgrow it because it's boring and stupid. I want to try that grownup serious relationship thing with a good person my age. I just replaced my five-year-old pair of hiking boots that got soaked yesterday at the volcano. I wish I could go spend a lot of time in the cave by myself, I wish I could indulge my ahab fantasies about the longest lava tube in north america, but I am afraid to go by myself because I might get hurt and then be stuck for a long time.

Cyst is my hand puppet, ha ha ha!

look everyone!! it's satan!! looks like he's appearing in the form of an immature, suburban, white guy again. how's things, satan? has that acne cleared up yet? stop picking at it and have your mom take you to the doctor. they have medicine for that, y'know.

Satan, get back in my closet, bitch! Cyst, just be yourself. See what moths fly to your flame. If you burn a few, so be it. They were flammable. But remember that the ones that don't burn might not have a soul. If you attract one of those, you're fucked.

hey cyst, i think you're doing just fine... you'll figure it out. shit girl, when you find yourself on a sunday night driving through the city listening to bad rap tunes on your way back home from returning a rottweiler's collar, leash, and a bandana to your friend's husband, gimme a call. we'll chat.

being fucked-up only makes you more intriguing to other fucked-up people. things fall apart.

the center does not hold

he sent me a message that wasn't completely awful. I wrote him back about the nw film center's new auditorium and how "breathless" is playing at the hollywood this week. I did not mention how I've been carrying a pipe around with me all weekend in case I decided to go see it early without my friend a., so I could get stoned in the car beforehand. not that that is psycho behavior, but I don't want to misrepresent myself.

don't dream it. be there.

Cyst, your being a child, you know you are being a bitch at times and you know why you are doing it. You are confirming what you already know. You didn't need the input from these people either. You know exactly what you are doing and why you are doing it. You post your pictures to confirm what you already know. You ponder over these trivial issues to give yourself some sort of reassurance, to help hide the fact that you can be a complete pain in the ass. So while you test waters, throw yourself around, attain the best (or worst) reaction possible from random people, you are slowly seeing what you can get away with. When you are behaving this way, you know why you are doing it. You are aware of it. It doesn't surprise you. However, what you may find is that people won't put up with it for long. Your beauty will not make it ok. People will eventually stop bothering. Yes you are exactly right. This guy did ask you to come hang out after 9pm (who are your friends the Cleaver's?) because he wanted to hang out and eventually get you in bed. Is that so wrong? Had you given him a reason to think that may be a possibility? What exactly are you expecting from this guy? Someone to eat pizza and do movies with? If so, start prowling the gay community for this type of person, because any straight man is mostly likely gonna want to get you in bed eventually. Agatha is right, there are plenty of good men out there who have good hearts, and they are out there and are attainable to you, if that's what you want. I got lucky, I found one, and it didn't come from being coy or catty. Just stop with the childish games if you do not like the reactions you are getting. You make your own bed. If I were this guy, I would stop bothering. You do come across as a needy pain in the ass. Someone needs to sit you down and demand maturity. I can't imagine any guy I am interested in responding favorably to this sort of cat and mouse. But then again, guys like to chase. Just be nice about it, and don't be surprised when they ignore you. You have it coming, especially after insulting their sheets because quite often a guy's mother buys him his sheets and you are indirectly insulting his mother. Bad bad bad. And his job?????? You have a made a mess, but it's no surprise to you is it?

Now tell us how you really feel, jos. I figure at this rate, cyst will cross a serial killer within 16 months, and a few weeks later we'll start to realize that all the threads here are no longer being turned into psychoanalysis sessions for her benefit and somebody will stop and say, "Whatever happened to that lanky chick with the pictures?" and we'll all speculate on how she moved to Berkeley to finish her graduate studies but got hooked on heroin and ended up selling wicker hats on Telegraph because the thought of somebody finding her bleached bones in the Nevada desert is just too unpleasant for anyone here to delve into.

hey. thanks for all the love. I corrected what I said about his inviting me over at 9 p.m. he emailed me at 1:30 p.m., saying I should drop by his place that evening. I think the meaning is slightly different. anyway. I'm forgiving myself. I'm going to pretend I can blame it on culture shock, part of a readjustment process, post-traumatic stress disorder, god knows what, and just try to cut the bullshit and act like my old stolid self. apart from working on one more apology to a friend I've had since high school, I'm going to just move on and not obsess over all this boring-ass shit. I'm hoping that shame about the photos isn't going to be a necessary part of recovery. I still like them, I still like my body, I'm glad I took the photos, and I'm still not embarrassed that others have seen them. oh well. if I can stop being a bitch first, then later I'll work on feeling bad about all that and reclaiming my american puritanical heritage. but I'll take them out of the pack of oregon trail murals photos I've been carrying around; I'll stop, as my friend a. said, "using them as a prop so [I] can proclaim my insanity without even having to open [my] mouth." ha ha ha. I'm sorry if I failed to mention that they were slutty in any url I provided on this site and if such a misrepresentation resulted in offending one of you innocents. really. I'll end up neither selling hats on the ave nor drying up in nevada. unfortunately, I predict a much less interesting end in some really standard life in the complacent pacific northwest. anyway.

it was tough love, baby.

I made you do it

these boards are just chock full o' incredibly happy, well-adjusted, non-fucked-up people. listen to their advice!

they're basically saying the same thing my friends have. just not as delicately. anyway, the true motivation for my changing my behavior is, of course, selfish. the coy bitch routine can be effective when used sparingly. I will not forget those skills, but I need to apply them only when appropriate. when I was stuck in that mode all the time, it was detrimental to my achieving my miserable little goals. I'm going to start being very careful.

wrong answer.

ouch. that smarts.

I thought honesty was good. now I'm even more confused. but anyway. life is a glorious cycle of song a medley of extemporanea and love is a thing that can never go wrong and I am marie of rumania

You've done a lot of exciting things, Cyst, but I wouldn't want to be you. It must be very difficult to be so aware of yourself and what you're doing. I can't imagian looking at myself as though I were not myself. I can see how I am, but I know my opinion is biased because I'm ME. You seem like you look at your life like a disinterested third-party. I hope I'm not being offensive in saying that. It just seems to me (shrink Gee) that you never really got over your shyness, so much as you're just ignoring it.

don't cry for me, argentina. I believe that everyone is motivated by selfishness, and there is no real altruism. I like to figure out why I do things, why other people do things, and it can usually be explained in terms of benefit to themselves. I don't even think I am especially wicked. that one week I listened to rush and dr. laura (I may have already mentioned this here, I've forgotten), dr. laura one day told some listener that she was a fool for wanting to go out and be single and see the world and not commit herself to a man while she had plenty of childbearing years ahead of her. she said something like, "when you're on your deathbed, the people you have near you, the ones telling you everything is ok, usually aren't travel agents." that hurt. almost as much as when I heard it from my godmother, the one I met this summer who told me I had a fat ass. but then I thought about it some more. dr. laura is advocating that people plan their lives around their elderly deathbed. make sure you create someone who will have to care! she's the crazy one. and isn't that ridiculously selfish, to get married and have kids just so someone will be around to love you later on? god. a few days ago at the gym I picked up a jane magazine and there was an article by this other chick who had been in the same neighborhood in istanbul at the same time I was, back in august. before, during and after the earthquake. she too was with a man who had to leave soon after and left her alone in the ghost town. we thought we were going to die. we were terrified for 45 seconds -- and that's a fuck of a long time to consider your imminent death. I didn't ask god for help, which I later thought was very interesting, because before I'd almost believed all that shit about no atheists in foxholes or however that saying goes. I did, however, beg my friend to tell me that the worst was over and that the aftershocks wouldn't bring the place down. I think I probably stupidly told him, please make it stop. this jane magazine writer talked about how much she was changed by this near-death experience. she saw the world all new, she saw how much life meant. blah blah blah. what if there is no elderly deathbed? I've often asked myself (especially in ukraine, especially in amateur taxis and on aeroflot flights), what if I died today? and I've always been ok with it. but aren't there more boundaries I'd like to check out? I've been a good student, I've been a loyal and true girlfriend, daughter, friend. what about all the other stuff? what about being a devushka, a cold russian bitch? what about being a pretend porn star, a pretend kept woman? what about shooting guns and snorting coke, hitting people who hit back, playing dress-up, loving and leaving fast? I mean, seriously, I don't have a lot of time left to act out all my bad-girl fantasies, to pretend I'm in some movie. but it's already gotten dull. and it's unsustainable. and it doesn't make me happy. I want to be content. my friend says zoloft would do the trick.

Try St John's Wort. It's cheaper. Aren't those near death experiences neat? I have one about every other day riding my motorcycle. It's almost as fun as flying on aeroflot. (I did one flight back in '84. Never _fucking_ again! There was LIVESTOCK on the plane.) Have fun with your mini midlife like crisis while it lasts. A constant awareness of your own mortality is something to strive for, but don't let it overwhelm you. If you get it right you can feel more alive, more "in the moment." Food tastes better. Sex is better. Love is easier to feel, for yourself and others. Every moment you realize you're alive is a revelation, a movable epiphany. But Nietzsche wasn't kidding about the void staring back into you. Live in the now, not at that dark moment when you're on the way out, not at that inevitable split second we all must go through, from the known to the unknown. I'll cut out the platitudes now. Maybe I should go back on the St John's Wort...

the thing that sucks about opening up, feeling, loving easily, loving with your whole heart, not being afraid to get hurt, and living passionately and always being true to yourself, being *real*... is that there are so few others in the world like that. most other people are just afraid and full of hate, or worse, despair. they return your love and openness with disdain and apathy. they hurt you. it's hard not to let it get to you, to fall to their level, or to start playing by their rules. of course it can be done, but not everyone is that strong.

love is a four letter word four is a four letter word word is a four letter word

I'll be at the side of your death bed.....

I thought my death bed was going to be a 70mph freeway wreck the other day. Then considered it might be the 90mph surface-street car chase that ensued. Now I'm not so sure - the pretend movie rolls on. That instant has passed, and I find myself still riding the crest of each new instant to come. I am content that I have been able to find love. (I do, passionately, love Lucy Phurre.) It sure seems like the hurt goes hand-in-hand with the love sometimes. All that other crap is bad though, just people being nasty to one another. But if you never let your guard down, you don't know what you are missing. Wake up! Time to die...

"I pray that i not die today, for i must go get a loan..... I need to get my credit straight before i'm dead and gone."

"the thing that sucks about opening up, feeling, loving easily, loving with your whole heart, not being afraid to get hurt, and living passionately and always being true to yourself, being *real*..." that's being real? that sounds more like being goofy.

You're just jealous.

i love you. passionately.

and I lust you too, passionlessly.

I thought about how bad it would look to my family,if my s/o and I O.D. on too much booze and pills at the Nogalous hotel we stayed at these last 4 days,and we almost did.I did get a picture of me on a donkey wearing a sombreo,and some meds.

j. don't od. go to costa rica. do you have your tickets yet?

I have to wait for the new tour to start in Jan.,after the 15th.

i don't think it's true that there are that few real people in the world. i meet them every day. just when you give up, that's when you will encounter a person like this.

Yeah, what she said! Just be glad YOU can achieve orgasm.(Based on all the other things you have done in your life, i assume you have, I would think after riding aeroflot in the ever so popular "Caucus" regions and all the other crazy things you imply, you would have gotten that out of the way early on). Sorry for my lack of tact in my last post. It wasn't exactly the best way to throw myself into the mix around here. I think I was a little turned on by your pictures. My sig other thinks you are "maternally sexy".

Cyst is lovely, and she should share that without shame. However, the thing that I learned is that it's not pretend. People will take that shit seriously and you have to know how to deal with them when they do. So it's a balance. I did all the stuff Cyst was doing (or the low-budget version anyway), then went celibate for nearly a year after a pregnancy scare. I kind of decided that I'm glad I did it, but I'm done. I decided that it was time for me to have a real relationship, and it takes time to find one. You have some hard times ahead, Cyst, but I will tell you it's worth it. BTW that really was my sweetie.

"maternally sexy"??? ugh. what does that mean? don't you have big tits and a big belly to look maternal? I don't want to look matronly. christ. ok. a guy talked to me about my sushi today at lunch. I'm glad I live in a city full of friendly strangers who speak english. have you NEVER achieved orgasm, josie? have you tried masturbation? I recently found out that a friend of mine has never done it. I thought she'd end up experimenting, as she said she was avoiding romantic relationships. but. then she decided to go out with the lying, cheating, alcoholic asshole friend of mine I introduced her to. christ. now she's cross-examining him and emailing me to ask whether I am sure he fucked that stripper while living with his ex-girlfriend. I was hoping she'd end up with my smart depressed programmer friend instead, but NO... josie, it's ok that you were mean to me. just be sure to keep posting and not desert us.

oh. read the other thread. got josie and pamela confused. ok.

I think pregnant people are kind of disgusting. I can't help it. Something's repulsive, it just sicks me out. It's not all of them, just every now and then. It looks better when they're carrying the child in their arms then in their stomach. I couldn't imagine getting pregnant, my body's just tiny compared to the ideal body for that kind of thing. And to think dog's like to urinate on them, tally that up on their side as another good reason to get stuffed.

Damn, I am sorry Cyst, (strike 2 eh?) I thought you might find that flattering. Let me see if I can explain it in a better way. Though the thought of having a child might make you shriek (it does me!!), you have a very classic, romantic look. You have wonderful curves, a cute belly, sexy breasts, you would look extremely sexy, nude holding a tiny infant. It would look natural. In fact I think you would be extremely sexy while pregnant. I think I read somewhere that you were tall or something. You would *hold* your child rather well. I expect to see someone like you in any given European super dramatic romance type film where the women is an icon of purity and the old world. I don't know, Like Water For Chocolate is coming to mind, not sure why. I know it may seem weird to some, but these things (amongst many other things) are sexy to me and my man. It was just a passing comment meant in the highest regards. I highly recommend a pocket rocket to all girls, whether single or not. They should be passed out in high school health class. "Mommies lil helpers"! I hate sushi. Though I love edemome(?) and their pot stickers.

Good book.

I have never had sushi nor have i ever actually seen a pregnate woman completly nude, so i cannot say whether or not i think it is sexy... All this talk about cyst has perked my interest.. Where can i see a picture of you??? j. Please tell more about your trips around the third world.. I plan to trop around down there soon and want to know where not to nodd out on xanax for fear of waking up naked with some farm animal/pet/family meal... Oh yea.. I am new here..hehehe

ahh shit here it comes

jina, that's a fucked up mentality about pregnant women, if you don't mind my saying so. i think pregnant women are beautiful, in general. of course, there are exceptions to every rule. i don't think junkie moms with sallow pimply skin look beautiful.

d - if you do your homework, you will find multiple listings of a couple urls for slutty photos of me. the berkeley and lonely planet guides to mexico and central america are both good. if you have any specific questions about mexico, guatemala, belize, honduras, nicaragua or el salvador, let me know. I've spent a lot of time there and recommend that others do as well.

Nobody go to Venezuela, okay? I think I've already told you guys about what happened to my father there this summer. Plus, he lived there 30 years ago, and he says it's worse off now politically, technologically, and socially than it was 30 years ago. And he went there for the express purpose of talking to the People (as opposed to the Tourist Magnets) to find out what they thought about the state of their country, so his opinion has support. And you don't know my dad, but knowing that he left the US excited to return to Venezuela, and that he came back to the US really depressed about what he saw...that's saying a lot. It takes a lot to bring him down.

I heard ecuador is a blast. take the train from the sea to the mountains. you get to ride on the roof.

Isn't anybody going to swear at the new people? I thought that was the tradition.

Lol,me too,Gee still want to go to Denneys with you,your a trip,bet we could get in some trouble.

hey gee, where's your fucking mail art? oh, you said the new people. sorry, i got confused.

allow me. fuck you, you fucking new people. we all hate you. love, sarah

Verbal abuse graciously accepted as a rite of passage around here. So do you guys all know each other personally or something? This has to be one of the most unusal, intriguing message boards I have stumbled upon. Bite me feverishly you club footed bastards! (there, hows does that work?)

allow me. fuck you, you fucking new people. we all hate you. love, sarah

You got it Josie!!! But I think blue balled bastard sounds better,but thats just me.

Ah, J. Always the poet.

I've never met anyone from these boards. I suspect they might all be the same person.

only 5 of them are me.

Only 5? You're losing your touch. Friday, Agatha. Is that okay?

A pointless Parable I was talking to "Connie" the other day and she told me how she used to use ol' Satan as a vibratin' dildo. Whenever "Bob" was away, out humping diplodocii and selling crow beaks to the Amish, and "Connie" was between paperboys and Jehovah's Witness's, well, she'd take Ol' Satan out of the little box she kept him in. She kept that box in her sock drawer, next to the bug porn. Well, she had ol' satan all lathered up with Old Spice and Kentucky Jelly, and she would stick him up her tally wacker and tell 'im to start buzzing. Well, Ol' Satan would try his durndest, but the best he could ever manage was a febble "zzss, zssss" and just was able to kind of shiver a little bit. Well, "Connie" had a bad day once. The paperboy was sick, the Jehovah's had converted to Rastafarianism and moved to Iceland, and "Bob' was out telling Bush Lite how to succeed in the oil industry, him being a fellow Texan and all. Well, "Connie" was getting mighty agitated, so she pulled Ol' Satan out of his box and plopped him up in her tallywhacker good and deep, and told him to start buzzing. Well, the devil was so worn out that he could barely purse his lips much less buzz and squirm around like a kitten on a stick, the way "Connie" liked it. So, "Connie" took him out and hurled him out the window in a fit of unsatisfied rage. "to Hell with the Devil!" She cried. "I'll go get me something real, to get my tallywhacker all nice and oozy!" So, she went out and got herself the new Buddha Christ Piston model tallywhacker attacker, and that poor Satan, well, he ended up trying to turn tricks on the li'l children who'd pass on by. One day, one of them picked him up and and threw him under the front wheel of "Bob's" new Harley, and he just got all tore up, so bad he looked like a plug of 'Frop. So, of course, "Bob" picked his wee ass up and stuffed him into his Pipe and smoked away. "Goddamn!" exclaimed "Bob". "That's got to be the weakest, blandest 'Frop I ever did suck down!" And with that, he went inside his ranch house and proceeded to screw the Daylights out of "Connie", the paperboy, and the wandering salesmen who were camping out under the bed.

zzss, zssss......

Sem,you really are special, but you know that already.

hey, d, here's a photo someone took of me at a halloween party a couple weeks ago. http://homepages.msn.com/Terminus/comfortplus/index.html

holy shit!!!!!! I have to come out of hiding for this and since you don't post your email cyst (on your site or here), i have to SAY, You and I are fucking identicle, minus the tits and the longer hair...look at this picture, http://members.tripod.com/accustat/wafflephoto2/page3.html this is not the best comparison, but I have pictures that have that same damn sassy, "I'm hot and know it look"......fucking A! are your eyes green or brown?.....me 6'3", you 6'2", my eyes green, hair dark brown like yours, were you adopted? better yet, was I adopted......? oh, you're all still assholes!

hi patrick

(sigh) hello heather, how are you?

wondering what the sigh means, but glad to see you

a sigh of ashame for my childish departure.... a sigh of acknowledgment that i miss you crazy fucks a sigh because i am tired a sigh for the acknowledgement that nate was right that i would be back a sigh of acknowledgement that my recent weeks on planet xanax and planet valium in the coedine cough syrup system have me realize how i like sharing my life with you digits.....

ease up on the saccharin o.d., man. you oughtta write hallmark cards.

It was that nausea again, wasn't it, Patrick? You know what I'm talking about. See, it always goes away, like you said.

Missed you Waffles,you and Heather being nice to each other,it,s like a Kodak moment,oh,I,m getting all hormone sniff, wierd,I gotta go find me some snot rags.Love

i think so Rhi......but then i got laid and soaked up serious amounts of narcotics, the wifey scored at the doctor, it looks like her wisdom teeth will be coming out shortly as well too.......bring on the demoral........ heather and I are actually getting married and looking forward to a life of polygamy. we have been conversing via email and seeuseeme, when she got a peek of my stately, statuesq physique, the anger subsided and cupid took over.......

Happy to see you back, Watrick. Paffles. Whatever...

Gretchen will be fine

I,m still waiting for a picture of you in a loin cloth.

i thought we weren't going to tell

ahh what the hell, someone put syrum in my coffee......i also enjoy dancing nude with a hula hoop to the ally mcbeal theme song

that photo . . .If anyone else noticed the hardwood floors the way I did, then you too perhaps have taken psychedelic drugs... I think there is more of a resemblance between Cyst and teh head of John the baptist she was carrying, except for the blue eyes. oh, hi, Patrick, good to see you back.

off the subject, this is a really cool link about a "date" with GG http://nerve.com/LisaDiaries/

semillama - john the baptist looks much nicer in person. when I was making him, I kept thinking, I wonder if real artists end up sculpting/painting themselves. I didn't want to make him look like me -- I purposely gave him fuller lips. and I gave him blue eyes because that's how oscar wilde described him. patrick - you are way better-looking than I am. my face is way too long. my russian teacher taught me how to say, "I have a long, thin nose." I have boring brown eyes. I'm not 6'2, I'm 6'3 too. you totally have the look I would stare at too long in a restaurant. if we truly looked alike, then you would look like my brother, which you don't. he is also very attractive, but in a less threatening way.

and semillama, you can't see the wood floor in the photo. it's a wood counter or something that I'm leaning against.

oh thank god. my I-am-not-psycho campaign worked. that guy invited me over again. and it only took a week.

The campaign's not over, though, is it? I thought this was a life-long plan you were working on. And Cyst, a word of cheer: your alledged psychosis doesn't come near that of the woman in Patrick's link.

I never knew Waffle left because he was angry. That's so unfair! After all my hard work trying to drive him stark raving mad to the woods and someone Else makes him go away! I feel so cheated.

the lisa diaries rock, read them weekly, she turns me on...... cyst, threatening?..i guessi do have that look in that phhoto, and i have been known to be aggressive and controlling at times..... we could debate who is the better looking, and you would win hands down.you know why? TITS! it's all about the tits. seriously though, i have a very long face as well, though it's hard to tell from the angle in my picture.......i had never viewed myself as attractive until i met my wife, and only on good days do i believe that. up until then i considered myself lucky for any interest from a female. long face, skinny arms, my hips used to just out past my stomach until i got a day job and started drinking. no i am average for my height, maybe a little under.....if i stopped drinking i would loose probably 10lbs in a week....but why bother, as long i don't gain any more weight in the wrong places. so when you see this guy cyst, knock him dead with your overpowering sexuality, then you may be able to get away with the psycho bitch crap a little more easily.

I question the sanity of any woman attracted to GG Allin. That's all I'm saying.

Hey, Patrick, have you ever heard of a zine called EXIT? The West Coast EXIT, not the East Coast version? Or at least the big book called "The EXIT Collection"?

no, you should read the rest of her diaries, she is a little off her rocker, but man if she doesn't turn me on with her crazy assed exploits

The EXIT zine is/was full of drawings and writings and strange collages that GG Allin and other weird people (like Jim "Foetus" Thirlwell and Richard Kern and Dave Ouimet and Henry Rollins and Lydia Lunch and others...like the Cop Shoot Cop boys, which is why I got it) sent in. Plus articles about cannibalism, Satanism, etc. Overall, there seems to be an obsession with Charles Manson and Hitler, and it's hard to tell whether the attitude is for or against. Pretty graphic stuff....not something I'd usually read, but some of the artwork is, errr, interesting.

some of that shit just bores me, GG bores me, rented a documentary this weekend but didn't get to watch about that guy, shit whats his name, wh was in a 9"nails video and got nails put through his hands for real, he was hugely into pain and torture and had ceribal palsy or something like that....he is dead now though...wish i would have seen it but the damn thing was also two days late....Lydia Lunch is ok, all that cult obsession, satanism, bsdm crap just doesn't move me......hyporcritically though, some photographers whom I admire do a lot with bsdm including Eric Kroll (in addition to kern) and this local guy Steve Diet Goedde. He has a book about the sensual side of fetish which is extrememly brilliant. here check out some of his work http://www.stevedietgoedde.com/ what is super cool about his work is he sticks to basic camera/darkroom work. He deosn't crop, dodge, burn etc. He gets his image right the first time, still uses a 35mm that he used in high school. He never digitally manipulates and he doesn't even use a flash. I admire and aspire to that as well, although i like flexibility of my flash...this is not the planet of the two suns...he did go to art school for something else. learned darkroom from his pop. Damn i wish my pop was a photographer, i think nate learned shit that was as did richard kern. whoooo sidetrack..... oh an Gee I don't think YOU could ever get me to leave and the fact that "cheats" you further illustrates my point NOT to because of anything you might say lots of lovin waffles

That's neat stuff there. I especially liked the photos of "FetishDiva" Midori crouching on the wall, the latex hands, and the guy from Evil Mothers floating on the couch. Where did you learn about Goedde? As for the EXIT zine, you're right about most of it being boring. I find most things and people that try to be shocking quite dull (which is why I have never been able to understand how anyone can take Marilyn Manson seriously), but that's probably because I'm so ornery. Anyway, some of the artwork really is neat. There's a series of one-panel drawing/photos taken from all different sources, and someone (i don't know if it's the zine editor or the artists themselves) have paired them with quotes from Nietzsche. One I remember was a drawing of a man smiling, but his cheek is cracking away, revealing his molars and jaw...and the quote is "all truths become poisons when kept hidden." I liked that.

i stumbled across his work online, i have only spoke with him via email. he seems nice. yeah i know the photo you ar referring to. His black and whites are extremely sexy and well framed, again, considering the effort that i sometimes put into correcting an image even slightly when printing and processing, he is extrememly talented

i met gg allin, he was very pathetic. i found his show so disturbing that i began to cry and could not stop. people were so mean there. it was horrible. he bit my friend ann later on that evening. she got tested for std's shortly thereafter, and miraculously came up clean.

oh success. apparently wednesday night a friend vouched for my mental stability ("she's more normal than she's letting on"), and that's why he invited me over. he's a total guy. he lifts weights, boxes, plays guitar, fixes cars. he has a really great body, way nicer than necessary or perhaps even desirable. a friend of mine says there's a point system to dating. everyone has a certain number of points for looks, brains, wealth, charm, etc. looks counts for more in chicks and wealth for more in guys. he says you end up going out with other people with roughly the same total number of points, but perhpas distributed differently. I don't like to use up all my points on someone else's biceps, you know? I think I read or heard somewhere that you're not supposed to sleep over on the first date or whatever. when I used that as my justification for leaving, I credited helen gurley brown, although I'm not sure she or her magazine actually ever advocated that. I am sure, however, that cosmo once said that when a guy asks you how many guys you've slept with, you're supposed to say three. we ate ben and jerry's and I told him that cosmo said that.

isn't gg allin the "alien sex fiend" guy? what did he do to make you break down and cry? play a james brown cover? actually, come to think of it, hearing alien sex fiend try to cover a james brown joint would probably make me cry, too.

no he was murdered, wasn't he? or stabbed and then died of his injuries or something like that? i think someone made a movie about him

this is gg allin??? jesus. that poor pathetic slob has no dick.

overdose rhi.....yeah, my friend got kicked out of England before he even left the airport. He was going over there to live and work and maybe attned a school he had scooped out. when customs asked him why he was there he told them just that (mistake #1). the proceeded to pull him into a room and interrogate him for 8 hours and search his shit.....when they came across his records he had with him, Rudimentary Peni and GG Allin (mistake 2) amongst others, they put him on the next flight out with no invite to ever come back. yeah i never saw the appeal of that fuck. performance art? hardly! artist? no way! musician? ahhh no, no way in hell! i accept the living statement he may have been towards society and her ills, but that is no reason to lob shit on people and be unecessary violent to the people who support you and your heroin habits.

yes, he is indeed a sad and embarrassing fixture in american musical culture. his penis was incredibly small, it's true. i don't usually notice men's packets, but it was pretty difficult to avoid in this situation. he had open sores all over his body. he kept taunting people in the audience. people were throwing shit at him and knocking him down on the stage, and he just kept getting up and playing some more. someone slapped the living crap out of his aesthetically cursed girlfriend while she stood on the stage. it was awful. he did have a nice pair of cowboy boots on, though.

i'm 99 and 44/100% positive that all of his sociopathic/self destructive behavior can be traced back to the fact that the miserable son of a bitch was born without a dick. "Q: If you had the opportunity to put a video on MTV, what would the content be like? A: A revolutionary video-- complete anarchy and chaos... The killing of police, violence, and terror against the system, government, assasination of the president, the murder of rock stars and music industry big shots.. Slicing through the throats of MTV VJ's and having an orgy in their blood." what a guy. he would've been great on the cast of The Real World.

I wouldn,t even call that a penis,I,d call that a mistake,while I have no pity for a junkie,I,m sure that the lack of a penis led to his decline.You have to say that even though he was peckerless,you have to give him 2 big balls for having the guts to show what he didn,t have.A goldfish could give him a b.j.

"When it's all over, what would you like your grave marker to say? GG ALLIN the ultimate adventurous, chaotic, dangerous, death defying, rock and roll terrorist. Lived and died for the rock and roll mission." after a life of self-torture, we remember him as: GG ALLIN He didn't have a dick. that's just plain depressing.

All you small-pecker-bashers better watch out. Remember what happened to me and J when we made fun of our exes (who were also drug-addled assholes with penchants for violence against women and, ahem, accoutrements which could not even be charitably described as modest) And how did we end up talking about GG Allin anyway? (well, somebody's gotta ask that once in a while... Personally, I blame Semillama, because, well, why not?)

alien sex fiend kick ass. well, maybe not their later dance stuff but "who's been sleeping in my brain" and "acid bath" were great. nik fiend is one ugly mutha.

jesus. that sick bastard probably has no johnson, either. i bet most of the evil in the world has been committed by frustrated dickless fucks. somebody better start a support group, 1-800 hotline, 12-step program or *some* shit. stop the madness!

he's actually a really nice guy.

I'm not going to comment. Shit, I just did. Sorry. I can't control myself. I have no dick. I take that back. I can control myself despite my dickless condition. I won't say what I want to say because it would be too harsh, hurtfull, and most of you wouldn't be able to handle it anyway.

antigone, take a look at the guy's nether-regions. i'm pretty sure you are more substantial than that. don't worry.

the kinda women you would want anyway there big fella would be keen to your mind more than your crotch. the power of mind for most women does far more that the length or girth a pecker, at least the kind that would do you justice anyway...... (giving you the John wayne click of the mouth, wink and point the fingers like a gun..)

http://www.pathfinder.com/time/magazine/articles/0,3266,32213,00.html ".....he suffered from what he calls "acute sexual starvation." Sexual references run throughout his book, and although he never ties them into a knot, one cannot help wondering if sexual frustration was his main despair. As an adolescent, he recalls, "my attempts to make advances to girls had such humiliating results that for many years afterward, even until after the age of 30, I found it excruciatingly difficult--almost impossible--to make advances to women... At the age of 19 to 20, I had a girlfriend; the only one I ever had....." -Ted Kaczynski

ok..that whole thing was obviously not a ted kaczynski quote..but a small part of a larger article..i refrenced that wrong..or something.. anyway..

Consolation appreciated, thanks. But we're just getting into stereotyping people's behavior based off of their physical attributes, which I think is fundamentally flawed. Swine: "i'm 99 and 44/100% positive that all of his sociopathic/self destructive behavior can be traced back to the fact that the miserable son of a bitch was born without a dick." Why not say, "i'm 99 and 44/100% positive that all of his sociopathic/self destructive behavior can be traced back to the fact that the miserable son of a bitch was born black."

no..i just think it all comes down to how people treat them when confronted with these physical or social abnormalities....and how they then go and turn against the world in a destructive manner..it all goes back to first grade..and picking on the little 'weirdo'.. ofcourse..we all have some sort of emotional glitch or physical flaw..or all of the above and then some..but..i think it takes a certain kind of person that just gets too much criticism for it..or who just can't handle a little..to flip out.. and i agree with swine..even if he was joking..about sexual frustration causing alot of evil..we're not talking about just small dicks, here..sexual frustration can mean alot of things..it's not just a physical deformity thing..

lighten up, spanky.

I don't get it. I still feel cheated, but Sting is singing something very nice and mellow and the map library boy spoke to me on thursday and that makes me happy. It doesn't take much. I go into the map library three times when I'm there, and every time I went in there he smiled and me and I smiled at him. The last time I went in there I walked right past him (he has a really nice back. I'm a suckre for a nice back.) and he said to me "What are you doing here?" smiling, and quietly because it's the map library and it's very quiet in there. And I said "Checking the copier." smiling back. What a dork. I should have stopped to talk to him. I know what his name is now, but I like calling him Map Library Boy. My little map library boy. It's like he's my sidekick. I realize now that I seem to have this Thing for boys with slightly off-set ears. Ears that pull away from the head a little bit. They just scream out to be grabbed. They're like little handles. (I don't mean that in a dirty way) It's hard to be hopeful. But at the same time it's fun.

Why single out sexual frustration?

because sex is everything. hello? maybe you should read cosmo and get a clue. duh?!

guessing me for bringing up g.g. allin was good, not correct. i kind of ignored G.G. Allin for the Pink boy he was. As for the no-dick thing, you don't see eunuchs running around the palace throwing feces around and cutting themselves up, now do you? Maybe it was a rage at not being able to be normal, so he had to try to destroy everything that was normal about him. A typical Pink action. Now, your subgenius also would like to wreck everything normal, but why be blatant about it? Besides, we have no desire to be "normal". I'll take someone positive like Oderus Urngus of Gwar over g.G.Allin anyday.

eunichs have a choice about their genitalia, generally speaking. i know that some eunichs get forced into the culture, but the majority of them choose to enter into that lifestyle. the only choice gg had about his genitalia was maybe that it would be slightly bigger if he hadn't shot heroin for twenty some odd years. i don't really have a point here other than to say that i don't think that your comparison is valid. i do think that pink people have a whole different set of issues than any other ethnic group. everybody has their own set of issues. it's so sad.

Pinks aren't an ethnic group, they're con dupes and false prophets. for example, donny and marie are pinks. so is Louis Farrakhan. so is that guy in hawaii who murdered his co-workers. so are teh so-called trench coat mafia, and also a lot if not all of their victims. in short, most folks are pinks. that's just the way it is. I'm a little radical for a subg and i think that thee are more than just pinks and subgenii, there seem to be folk who don't fit either description, like a lot of discordians, and a lot of the folks here who aren't subgenii but who don't seem Pink either. There are definitely a few latent subgeniii lurking about here for certain, tho. I won't name names, that's for "Bob" to do.

he has a chenille couch. his apartment is really neat and tidy. he tans. he goes to the gym. he struts around naked. he chats endlessly, especially likes talking about dick size. he never eats seafood, doesn't like that fishy smell. so fucking funny. I can't believe I didn't realize until tonight.

Interested in your categories, Sem. It's church of subgenius stuff, right?

he wanted me to take all my clothes off, but only so he wouldn't feel weird about having taken off all of his. I asked him how many chicks he'd slept with. he said a lot. I asked if it was a two-digit number, expecting him to say yes. he said no. I was really confused. nine isn't a lot, not for a 36-year-old bachelor. "is it a one-digit number?" he laughed. "you've slept with over a hundred women?" "a few years ago I tried to make a list. you know, like, 'that one blond girl at that drummer's party,' and I stopped at 112. but then for days I'd be driving around, and I'd think, 'oh yeah, HER too.'" he was so uninterested in me, it was stunning. I let him pull most of my clothes off, and he wasn't even really looking. he couldn't have cared less. I started giggling. "what?" he said. I couldn't think of the right words. "you're just ... umm... you're radiating this ... profound indifference toward me. I mean, I guess you've seen a hell of a lot of naked chicks, you must be getting bored with them." I'd told my friends I was going to go over to this guy's apartment again, and they warned me about the "cheap, empty, hollow" feelings that can come from such encounters. I said I thought it would be fun, and they said no. this wasn't fun, but it was interesting. I was glad I'd come just to get this over with. I no longer had a crush on him and instead was just completely awed by the things he was saying to me. "I'm not indifferent toward you, just indifferent toward the idea of your being my girlfriend. no, 'indifferent' isn't the right word. because I know that I definitely don't want you as a girlfriend. I mean, you're nice and all, but I can tell it would never work. I can't always tell if it would work, but I can always tell when it wouldn't." amazing. what else could he possibly say to make this situation even more surreal? "yeah, I've had sex with a lot of chicks, but I like to sleep alone. they always want to stay and I always want them to leave. do you like my dick? would you jack me off? that would feel great." I wasn't insulted at all. it was so fucking funny. I'd met my match. a creature who was cuter and colder and more pathetic than I was. he even justified himself in the same way that I do. I told him that he was selfish, and then he pointed out examples in his life of when he had acted unselfishly. but he'd only ever told one of the 150 women that he loved her. all his long-term relationships ended when the woman finally got tired of his lack of interest in her. he told me, "let's not fuck so we don't have to deal with all those problems. why don't you just jack me off? I could get you off too if you wanted." then he told me to stop laughing.

i guess i thought pink meant skin color. i don't know anything about subgenius ideology.

him - please? it would feel SO good. me - I don't know. now I feel like you're my PAL and all. him - you're not my pal. first jack me off, then we can be pals. me - maybe. him - oh come on. why not? me - well, I'm a little disturbed at the thought of my making you come and then your dismissing me. him - well, you wouldn't have to leave right away. we could watch conan o'brien if you wanted. I'm going to take your panties off now. me - why? why do you care? you don't care. him - I want to see your puss. get on the bed. I'll go get the lotion. it'll be fun. me - what kind of moisturizing lotion do you use? him - lubriderm. me - good choice. the trader joe's stuff works well too, and it's cheaper. I'd never been with someone when there was absolutely no affection or longing on either side, so that was weird, but I wasn't averse to the idea of touching him. his skin was soft -- like a chick's, he had said. I'd given lots of pity handjobs in college but never to a physically perfect closeted homo. was he really gay? or was it possible he was straight but 100 percent self-involved instead of just 98 or 99 percent like normal people? I wanted to try out the bed. he said he had some fancy mattress -- everything in his apartment was retro and expensive. I know my closest gay friend would have called him a "furniture fag." we got on the bed and I let him pull my underwear off. I mean, it wasn't like he was going to do anything anyway. earlier he had been talking about his cock, how it was normal size but he could shoot like a porn star. "could you hit your nose?" I asked politely. "if I hadn't come in a while, I could hit that wall three feet behind me," he said. I got him going and thought about how long it would be before I'd see him walking down the street or in a theater or store and whether I'd pretend not to have noticed. I decided I would say hi. when he came it was like being in a hot shower. he came all over my chest and arm; it got in my hair, on the bed. he told me he'd get a warm, wet towel, and I thought that was really nice. much classier than a dirty t-shirt on the floor by the bed, which is what I used to get. he didn't even have any dirty clothes or junk anywhere in sight. it took a while for the water to warm up, and he said, "please stay calm. everything is under control." it was really funny. I couldn't get myself to feel used or insulted or upset or anything. he asked me what I thought about his dick, how I would rate it on a scale from 1 to 10. I said I didn't know, that it was fine, that it was a little bit larger than average, that he seemed like he'd be a good fuck, that he had incredible loft. but he wanted more. "how would you rate it on a scale from one to ten?" "I don't know. a seven?" "a seven, you say. so that really means a five." I was getting tired of talking about his cock. "yeah, maybe you're right. more like a five." I was going to leave but he stayed chatty and kept asking me if he could tell me stories of all the girls he's fucked before. I let him. it all started in fifth grade. he and a buddy used to go into the woods with this 10-year-old girl, who would take all her clothes off and lie on the ground for them. while telling the stories, he'd sometimes use my naked body as a prop, showing me the things he had done. "we used to ask her if we could kiss her titties, and we'd kiss them (like this) and then run away. "one time I tried to fuck her. we'd had our first sex ed class that year, so we went to the woods and I got on top of her and we looked for a hole. we thought when it was time to fuck, a hole would magically appear. "my friend was holding my little chubby and was trying to put it in her, but we couldn't find any hole." he had lots of funny stories, and I could tell he was glad to have a new audience for them. I was getting tired and decided what I really wanted to do was get dressed and go to taco bell. "everyone's getting out of the bars now, so drive really carefully," he told me. "I will," I said.

Cyst, he sounds like an insecure and very boring man, too boring and insecure to be funny or interesting, and why did you stay that long? Taco Bell was the much better choice, just overdue perhaps.

he was really cute. it was a good refresher course ("cute is worthless," soc 121). plus, he was a project I needed to finish. if I hadn't stayed and figured him out, then I'd still be wondering what I was missing. now I know -- nothing. before I left I asked him if he knew that I didn't like him. "I like you as a person, but I don't LIKE you like you. I'm just telling you this because I don't want you to feel sorry for me." "I wouldn't feel sorry for you. lots of girls like me who I don't like back, and all I think is, 'get over it, babe.'" hahahahahahahaha. it's so fun to be single.

how did you keep yourself from vomiting? "get over it babe"

sad. just sad. That man, Agatha, is exactly what I mean by "Pink". What a waste of great potential for glorious sexhurt oozsquirt. Antigone - yes CoSG it is . I like your stories, Cyst. They make me take a pause.

what a fucking loser. you should have told him that his dick was very small and unappealing. he probably would have broken down and cried like a little girl.

it was really funny. I was amazed at how much stupid crap this guy could get away with just because he was cute. I also liked how personable and kind and humane he made me feel in comparison. and I knew I would never see him again, so nothing mattered. before I left I asked him if he wanted to know what I thought of him. I told him I could think about it, write something up, and send it to him. he said that he didn't need to know what I thought of him because he felt secure enough in who he was that he no longer cared how other people interpreted him. "you're afraid, aren't you? of what I would say." he said no, that as he got older, what other people thought mattered less. liar. but that's ok. I'm no walk in the park myself.

thinking that everyone gives a shit is a common misconception. some people really don't.

he did. intensely.

That guy's my hero.

Just kidding.

I found that story very ironic. I also feel sorry for people who really don't care what anyone thinks about them.

One of my psych professors says his short-hand definition of mental illness is not knowing or not caring what people think of them.

funny. that's my short-hand definition of freedom.

I thought it was romantic. Especially the part where he bragged about being able to hit the wall behind his head.

Sleazebags like that are a dime a dozen. Don't go there. The thing is that you may know it's bullshit, but it doesn't change the fact that guys like that really are usually nasty, horrible people. I know I've had to use physical force to enforce my "no glove, no love" rule. Fortunately, I have a penchant for small, delicately built men. I suggest you develop one if you are going to continue doing this. I guess my point is be careful out there. These guys really are dangerous... both because they are incautious about STD's and because a lot of them really are psychos. It really is worth the wait to find the right guy. And it's hard to find the right guy by the means you are currently employing. I know. I tried it. I found the right guy by accident, and I wouldn't let him kiss me goodnight when we met. Result: *despite* Lather's lovably Puckish sense of humor, he retains the ability to accomplish and recognize a genuine sense of romance...he is playing guitar for me right now. In short, I found a good one, and it only happened after I stopped doing the promiscuity thing. Looking back on that, it does seem a bit priggish. I guess I am kind of glad I had the experience, and I don't regret it, but I wouldn't do it again. I don't have to, though, I already have. I'm really tired and haven't slept much, so I don't know what I'm doing trying to offer you clarity, as I don't seem to have my own mind made up, so I guess just take it as a fairly representative cross-section of the opinions of the people in Lucy's head. Hopefully part of it will be useful. But a guy like you described isn't even worth fucking. The sleaziest I've ever even considered bothering with has always retained a sense of artistry about sex. If they don't have that, they have nothing to reccommend them at all.

Freedom is insanity. And I find it funny that Lucy uses physical force to get what she wants from men.

Ahem, I think you misunderstood me. I do, when necessry, use physical force to defend my right not to give a man what he wants.

I'd known the guy wasn't psycho. he's a long-time friend of a friend of mine. I asked my friend if this guy were scary, and he said, "I don't think he'd drag out out to the woods and rape you." maybe in the future I should be wary about such ringing endorsements. anyway. I'm going to be more careful. last night I ended up going to gay bars, and I decided no bisexual men, especially not cute ones who drive fast and talk about how much they want a family.

No way. Lucy is gentle as a kitten. Well, except for that time she popped me one, "accidentally". Oh, and when she bent me to her will the other day and had her way with me. Actually, all of those other days she bent me to her will and had her way with me. Hmm, you know, I think there just *may* be a pattern here. Lucy, mellow out or I'll spank! (Maybe we could also talk about de-clawing?)

Like I said, Lucy. So sometimes what you want is nothing. You still use physical force to get it.

And you also find "small, delicately built" men whom you can use these tactics on.

please, antigone, don't incite any couple bickering.

Why not?

I can press Lucy, so please don't give me that "small, delicately built" crap. ;>

"Mental illness is the key to freedom.' -Jello Biafra, on the last pigface album.

synchronicity.

I didn't. She did.

Nya nya.

Oh gawd. *sigh* No, she didn't. You did. A penchant for small delicately built men is one thing. Saying that she "finds" these poor little dudes, then dominates them with physical force "tactics", is quite another.

Penchant: a strong and continued inclination. I guess she uses this "strong inclination" passively, then. All I'm saying is that I find it ironic Lucy made a statement like that. If any man had used the phrases "small, delicate woman" and "physical force" in such proximity to each other I'm sure Lucy would call him a rapist. I've noticed that she has a penchant for such reactions.

Oooh jeez, I hadn't realized! So my virtue may actually be at risk then!? Rest assured, from now on I'm sleeping with a baseball bat under my pillow...

Antigone, I will give you a typical anecdote, and then you can call me a rapist if you want. I met a guy at a punk show. We were in the bathroom, which is unisex at such events, as there are enough goths, who don't know or don't care about the difference. I had already told him that I would not have sex without a condom, and he didn't have one. He attempted to intimidate me. I told him I could bench press him. He attempted to prevent me from leaving. I picked him up and moved him out of my way, without harming him (unless you count damage to his fragile male ego.) So, this makes me a rapist? I preferred small, delicately built men because it meant I could leave if I had to. Lather is actually the first guy I've ever dated who could beat me in a fair fight, and we're pretty evenly matched at close range. Right, sweetie? ;)

Thanks Sem,now I know I,m free,thinking of an old Cream song.

lalalalalalalalalalalala cyst i found your story to be very amusing, a slight turn on at one critical point, and overall typical of the life i have never had. it sounded straight out of a david lynch film starring drew barrymore and that pretty boy in fight club lucy, i think this guy was more than honest with her from the beginning. i don't see what is so sleazy about him. he was honest, has a self esteem for god sake, hell so many people have gone without a self esteem for so long they have no idea how to react to someone who seems genuinely indifferent to what you think about them. if cyst had left in disgust, what would he have done? call up the next broad who would willingly come over and jerk him off and do his dishes in the nude if he asked. IF he asks and she says no, he is a jerk, if he asks and she says yes, it's ok? i admit this guy would have gotten on my nerves if i were you too. all the talk about his pecker would have annoyed me. "both because they are incautious about STD's and because a lot of them really are psychos." last i checked, a hand job poses very little if any at all of a risk to exposing on to an STD. Should she have worn a rubber glove?...OUCH! Also this statement can be applied to any number of women as easily. Rape cases aside, it takes two to tango so if a women doesn't insist on the condom anymore than he does, she is just to blame. lalalalalalalalala i love it cyst, who is next?

My point was that he sounded like someone who wasn't particularly special. Not that he was an asshole because she was/wasn't interested in him. And the warning about STD's was general. So was the warning about psychos. However, everything I say is evil because I am a feminist and hate all white males. Ask Lather... I beat him and bend him to my will all the time with my evil feminist cohorts.

i'd love to get in the ring with ya, nothing bleeds better than a feminist, espeically vegetarian one's , they bruise easier and fall sooner..........i am working on making my marriage more efficient by putting the bed in the kithcen...

patrick - thanks for liking my story. I hope someday I'll be able to write instead of just report. because I don't know how much longer I can continue being such a weirdo. saturday night I got drunk and was slightly tempted to do things because I thought they would be interesting. I have no good prospects right now. I could look up the cute bakery boy from a year ago. there's the guy who told me I shouldn't get into his car in that outfit because we'd get in a wreck. the guy who said it was "nothing but a pleasure." my friend-of-a-friend who took me out and I didn't realize it was a date until afterward. but one of them I think I could take seriously, so I really shouldn't do anything at all until I'm sure I could handle it. and two of the others are too nice to fuck with. the other's a total player but I've already written about him anyway. a friend of mine invited me up north to be in a short film he's doing next week and I am considering calling in sick. but I'm not bad.

Patrick- I'll take you on, but you'll have to take on me and my band of evil insubordinate women. We never give a white male a fair shake. Cyst- I don't know. I did that whole trip and it was fun for a while. I don't regret it because I was careful. But it's not the way to find the right kind of guy to settle down with. In my experience, though, when you want to settle down, you'll go out and find the kind of guy with whom you want to settle down, which may or may not be the same as my right kind of guy.

and when you find him do you beat him into submission? gRRRRRRRRR!

i liked cyst's story, too. so did juan, my friend who was up from galveston this weekend. for the past ten years he's been planning to be a filmmaker, and he started trying to build a whole movie out of it. we were stoned. i wrote a song for him: "brain cell's juan song". oh what night.

by the way, all of you seattle/washington freaks......just wondering, have you heard or seen a band called Jessamine? Just wondering. They did 2 albums on Kranky records, and I am wondering if they are still around. i am pretty sure thats where they are from.

they sure are. they were at... the sit and spin, i think it was, not so long ago. maybe not there. but i definitely see the name around town. how many seattleites are there here?

i dunno, but a co-worker was telling me about that place sit and spin.....what a fucking novel idea.........and you should see them if you like atmospheric indie haze with made with lots of analog seasoning

my friend worked there for a very long time. it's a shithole and people steal your pin-striped suit pants from the dryer. trust me. and they have bad food and no oxygen. er. indie hazes aren't really my deal, but seldom can i turn down a band suggestion. there are so many terrible bands around town.

you should go see vandemonium, hydra. that's my sister's band. i love jessamine. i know one of the girls, she used to work at allegro cafe in the u district. she was always very sweet, and made good coffee. her name was dawn. if you like them, you should check out sycophant.

i hear great things about sycophant. but, truth is, i'm not very good at dealing with tiny, smoky, stinky clubs that are filled to capacity with loud, stupid, stinky people... so i don't go to many shows. i just never have fun. it's a shame. maybe i'll get a cd of theirs. i like allegro cafe.

do you ever get/leave notes on the message board?

i left a flyer there looking for print studio space. it didn't work.

awesome story. again. my favorite part. "he asked me what I thought about his dick, how I would rate it on a scale from 1 to 10. I said I didn't know, that it was fine, that it was a little bit larger than average, that he seemed like he'd be a good fuck, that he had incredible loft. "

and what a great post to reiterate what a fucking drag lucy was. a serious fucking drag.

thanks for bringing this thread back, what a simple, sweet story of the closeted guy who could shoot 3 feet. Darling Cyst. I love it! And lucy, the ruiner.

I know that Lucy evolved into a psycho later on, but looking back at this thread, it does kind of seem like you guys were nitpicking at her. maybe we Made her psycho.

That story depressed the hell out of me. Thank God she doesn't do that kind of shit anymore. Jesus.

i want to know why spider?

Why? Because giving a handjob to someone who very clearly doesn't give a shit about you doesn't sound like a pleasant way to spend an evening.

Yes, interesting to reflect. That was five years ago! We're so old!

well yeah spider. thats a fairly black and white take on the event wouldnt you say? whats hard is perhaps acknowledging the potential for excitement. sometimes the experience itself contains a value. i dont see cyst in any way as a kind of victim in this. it was pretty evident she didnt give much a rats ass about him either. I generally regard the event as amusing and potentially titilating and at the very least a grat fucking story. both were selfish, and im not sure i saw any harm done either way.

i wouldn't put being showered with sperm in the "no harm done" category. but that's just me.

perhaps they had a wonderful evening before going back to his place. Maybe she just felt like giving someone a handjob. It could happen. Being showered in sperm could be hilarious.

well shit, its not like she didnt know the faucet was going to run when turned. showered in jizz is sorta beside the point. and did get her a warm towel as opposed to the dirty shirt beside the bed. i wonder how delighted dear C is to have this revived.

well, i prefer that you all keep your sperm away from me. in fact, pretty much all your fluids -- pee, pus, blood, sweat, saliva, snot. it's all the same.

did that sound snarky?

I'ma go lick you now. Isn't it funny that our Cyst is all growed up and married off now?

*sigh

she is? I wish I knew more about the outside lives of departed posters.

"I'm at one of those times when I think, "wow. maybe I really am a psycho bitch." i think im there, now. not that that means anything in this time warp. think of it this way people, we miss cyst and droop (though she graces us with a random line every now and then)... ...no matter, as these boards are made to be mined. its particularly great when the mining is done by a 'frank' a 'linda' or a 'coochie' . otherwise nameless drifter in for one drink and out.

you would know all this stuff if you hadn't gone out and gotten a life instead of reading Sorabji, Gee! *sob sob* perhaps we should make a newsletter.

no, but seriously, we got to see her wedding photos and everything.

oh, hell. hi, you guys. I am old and grown up and married and really very good now. oh, hell. hi, you guys.

(will I cry from embarrassment if I go back and read this thread? why am I here?)

"I'll end up neither selling hats on the ave nor drying up in nevada. unfortunately, I predict a much less interesting end in some really standard life in the complacent pacific northwest." I was right about this, by the way. all that crazy shit was from my late-20s crisis. since then I have gotten and retained a normal office job that I like and met and married a man whom I love. I'm living a really standard life in the complacent pacific northwest. is there new generation of crazy girls? whose stories should I look out for? I'm here as one of the tribe elders now.

i thik it's just me. it's slut summer. mostly i don't tell.

CYST,are you real???? I thought you went off line years back.

dont look him in the eye c

Warning Warning PULLUP PULLUP!

Is that like, "Nuns! Nuns! Reverse! Reverse!" ?

Feck! Arse! Girls!

Yay! You watch it too!