anyone seen it? i saw it last night, i'm still not exactly sure how i feel about it.

I saw it. I didn't like it. Formula nazi movie with a dissapointing ending. But I could stare at Edward Norton all day.

both of the skinheads were very fine, i must confess. especially the older brother, with those righteous pecs. it was amazing how quickly the younger brother came to terms with his new found position on race after his big brother talked to him. the whole thing was too pat, but there were some nicely shot scenes and i liked the teacher. the music was all wrong.

Put your MOUTH on the curb NIGGER

*gasp*

I am beginning to think he is trying to overcompensate for his lack of a beefsnake. What is the point of dragging up 2-3 year old threads and then saying something stupid or offensive and not saying anything of importance or intelligence?

it's a line in the movie. not that i'm defending him.

now I know not to watch the movie. Thanx.

I liked the movie, but it was so bloody long. And mmmm Edward Norton.

Edward Norton is just a little too skinny for me. I like men with a little meat on their bones.

Well I like Vin Diesel better. His voice is so damn sexy.

You are doing yourself a disservice by not watching the movie, eri. IMO, it should be required viewing. Plus, Edward Norton gained like 20 lbs of cut muscle for the role, so there's the meat for your bones! Seriously, watch it. It may not make you feel good, but it will make you think good.

I have a hard time watching movies that involve white supremacy. 1. because I have already seen too much in real life and 2. because I am so against it in any form. I find that I usually dislike them, no matter how well they are put together. I don't really find them entertaining. Then again, there are a few movies I watch just for the educational or historical values of them, but they are very few.

This is one of them.

I might give it a try, but not for Edward Norton. I'll leave him to the women who like small framed men :D

Norton is anything but small in that movie. What's crazy to me is, afterwards, he went back to being this skinny little guy! All that hard work, gone.

stop being so closed minded eri. its a good film. there is no reason not to watch it. your dislike of the subject matter is one thing, your dislike for the cinema is another.

Kinda like Donnie Wahlberg in Sixth Sense. He is usually built and muscular, but for this movie he lost 80 lbs and looked almost unrecognizable. Then he went back and gained the weight back. Difference being he lost the weight for work and he got it back afterward, and he looks better with the muscles :D

Closed minded? Didn't I'd say that I would watch it? Who said I dislike the cinema? I just watch movies for different reasons that just watching a movie. I want to be entertained or get something out of it. If this is educational in material, then I will watch it and hope that I like it. The reason I didn't watch it before is that I didn't think I would enjoy the subject matter, ya genius!

"get something out of it" you can't get anything out of it, if you don't see it. this is closed minded.

How many times do I have to say that I already agreed to see it?!?!?! Are you missing this point? Besides, sometimes you can see it and still not get anything out of it. Not everybody gets the same things out of the same things. Not everyone likes the same things. It is part of being different. If you know something is horrible beyond your imagination, they why continue to watch other things that show you how horrible something is just to leave you knowing that it is still horrible beyond imagination, but having more information on other horrible things involved in it? I know Hitler was horrible, and I know that I will never understand his mind, and I know I share a birthday with the fuck. I have read the Diary of Ann Frank and seen Schindler's List (which bored me to tears literally) and read his wife's journal. I have studied WWII and his role in it and the persecution of the Jews. I don't have any desire to learn even more about him, it would only lead me to the same conclusions, being that he is an ass and I will never understand him, nor do I have any desire to understand his sick twisted mind. Taking that into account, why would I watch another movie about Hitler or his role in WWII? No point in it. Same thing when I see previews of some movie about white supremacy. It isn't being closed minded, it is that there is no point and I won't get anything out of it, other than other facts about something so horrible that I will never fully understand it and I don't have any desire to. Knowing it is unfathomably horrid and wrong is enough for me. More useless facts about something I already detest holds no interest for me. If this is closed minded, then in a way, we all are, just about different things. My world doesn't revolve around movies showing the worst that humanity has done in history. When was the last time you went to a church Patrick, or is it that you are closed minded in your beliefs regarding religion and therefore won't go to a church to learn more about what the religion has to teach and the history of that church? You can't get anything out of it if you don't try it.

eri im just responding to what you say. i saw you agreed to see it the first time. my religious beliefs and subsequent practices have nothing to do with being closed minded, it has to do with the fact that I have made an fairly educated decision, after attending several denomination services as a kid and teen, not to subscribe to christian doctrine. Should I have a desire to learn more about the Bible and its contents I'll take a college course.

Take a college course on the Bible?????? That makes just about as much sense and learning how to be a lesbian from a male homosexual......

further, in thinking of your ridiculous comparison to my spiritual beliefs...in college i did take a religious studies class. We studied christianity, budhism, hinduism and (if you can lump it to this) native americanism (specifically the Sioux I believe it was). I've had enough education in my life, in school or actually attending services (Southern Baptist, Lutheran, Presbyterian, Methodist) to know its not for me. Thats not to say I don't any spirituality or faith in something greater than us. I do, im not just not terribly convinced of anything just yet. But you know if someone recommended a kick ass book, dealing with....uhh say....Siddhartha, I wouldnt NOT read it because I don't subscribe to Hinduism or Budhism. Thats the difference. Ultimately I don't care if you do or, its just like, so many other things, your closed-minded attitude shocks the hell out of me.

"That makes just about as much sense and learning how to be a lesbian from a male homosexual......" or shows how much of a dope you can be. Id rather get a perspective from a religious studies professor that specializes in studying historical relevance who isnt swayed by doctrine than one delt out by a minister. how does one learn to be a lesbian? where did you learn how to be a straight man?

Be nice, Patrick. "Id rather get a perspective from a religious studies professor that specializes in studying historical relevance who isnt swayed by doctrine than one delt out by a minister." The professor isn't going to be coming to the material from the same perspective. S/he's got his/her own bias, which they would be passing along to you. You'd be better off reading the sacred scriptures (of whatever religion) on your own. Not that you haven't already. I'm just saying.

Patrick, Learing about religion from a purely "educational" point of view is one thing, except that what you are taught is subject to the teacher's views, wether intentional or not. Religion is not about facts. It is what you get out of it personally. I, for one, do not subscribe to any organized religion. I am still undecided in the existance of a "higher being". While I profoundly hope there is a race out there somewhere better, more educated, more civilized then the human race, I am not ready to subscribe to the notion that there is a God out there who created us, sent his son to die for our sinse, and told us to either live life his way, or burn in hell forever. To me, that is not a just or loving god. But that is my take on it. I have never heard a single preacher mention that. In any form of art, wether it is a painting, book, song, or sculpture, there are two ways to interperit the works. Yours and the creators. A good creator will not try to get you to see the work of art their way, but rather is interested in how you perceive it. A true art enthusiast (i know that is spelled correctly) will not push their view of the art work on you, and insist you see it their way, but might be interested in how you see it. or maybe their not. because your take may taint their understanding of it. On this board, we discuss and debate and fight about our views, and in the end, most of the time, our views have not changed. Mine did on conservatives and some conservative issues, but mostly my views stay the same. I find it interesting to see how Nate and J and you and cat and others see the world events, and I enjoy venting and sharing my views, but I do not want to change your views. The views you have reflect the fabric of your life and your experiences. It is bound to be different. In some cases, it may be shocking, in others it may be anticipated. but in the end, we have no impact on what actually happens, so what is wrong with a differing opinion? I will still not waste $10+ on a movie I could care less about just to "broaden my horizons". I will not watch snuff films to see what happens when some one is raped and killed. I do not need to see that to know it is horrible. I do not need to see kiddie porn to know that kiddie porn is disgusting. I do not need to see a movie about racist murders to know that racist murders are wrong.

""That makes just about as much sense and learning how to be a lesbian from a male homosexual......" or shows how much of a dope you can be." That proves my point. I am a dope because I do not see the world the way you do. I think religious education from a secular teacher is a waste of time. You want history, take a history class, not a theology class. You want to understand the bible? read it on your own. I did, and parts of the koran, and parts of the Mormon Bible. I have not had the oppertunity to read others yet. Oh, and as far as "how do you learn to be a lesbian" i meant the physical part, not emotional.

there no logic in your comparison trace. for fucksake man.

How can a person who is not religious teach you how religious people see religion?????? THAT IS THE LOGIC IN MY COMPARISON

So you can study religion on your own and make your own conclusions about it and not attend church. I study WWII, Hitler, White Supremacy, KKK and other such disasters on my own, and choose not to see yet another movie about it and I am closed minded, but you are not because you studied it before, when I studied it before. You came to your conclusions and that is just fine, but when I come to my own conclusions I am closed-minded? This is what I mean when I say you are a hypocrite. What is good for you is only good for someone else if they see it the same way as you do, but apply the exact same principle to something else and you are right and they are wrong. Whatever, Patrick. I am not going to defend myself or explain myself to you. It wouldn't do any good. You are too full of your own self-righteousness to see the nose in front of your face.

The magic of religion is not in facts, but in the view of the religious

I don't know about you guys, but I learned to be a lesbian the old-fashioned way -- through a correspondence school.

It wasnt that one that Sally Struthers used to avertise for, was it????

I could see it now: "get your degree in accounting, computers, education, highschool diploma, lesbianism, refrigiration or vcr repair"

Why yes, yes it was. I was watching TV late one night, depressed about being a straight male with no female company for the past two years, when lo and behold, lovely Sally Struthers came on the tv telling me how my life could change by becoming a male lesbian. I passed the course with honors and in record time, devouring subjects such as, "Underarm And Leg Hair: What Is It and Why You Need It", "Butch or Femme? Choose Wisely", and "Why Do They Call It Carpet Munching?" Best money I ever spent. Now, my phone is ringing off the hook with girls just dying to meet me. And now I'm currently working on my Air Conditioning/Refrigerator Repairwoman certification. I get another free toolbox when I graduate.

what was in the toolbox you got from the other class?

Use your imagination, sweetcheeks!

i thought boys were taught to be gay males by catholic priests.

I'm Methodist.

"How can a person who is not religious teach you how religious people see religion??????" I would not go to a professor or college course to learn HOW to be religious, fucktard. i would go to learn the history and doctrine of a said religion. Id go to a local priest/monk/rabbi etc to find out how to make it work in a modern context. (i.e. to put said religion into action) do you understand the difference?

asking the religous to understand religion is like asking a fish to understand water.

Asking a fish to understand bicycles is like getting a carpet licking degree from correspondence school.

My pet lungfish rides the shit out of his little clown bike in my house. I don't what kind of bizzaro world you guys are living in.

Dougie, you're on today.

I see said the blind man. for the record, i never said ask a preaher about religion. that is like asking aalesmen to explain why you need a car. litterly. I am not sure very many scholars can explain where religion started or came from without some form of bias, however. i would think independent research would serve best.

I'm leaning towards towards an autonomous agent social simulation technique, myself.

Religion was created as a means of controlling agrarian societies. I should know. I learned about it in the religion course that I got off the tv From Sally Struthers.

hmmmm spunk need spelling lessons, does sally struthers sell them???

I caught the end of this movie last night. OK, so I didn't see the first 3/4, but the ending seemed kinda weak to me. Can someone briefly sum up the plot? I got: Badass Neonazi (who may or may not have been a Neonazi at the start of the movie) kills two guys, gets sent to prison, becomes friends with a black guy, stuff happens (I flipped the channel a few times), he gets raped, he comes to his senses re Nazism, gets out of jail, finds his kid brother(?) and says, "boy, what was I thinking, huh?" End. Is there more to it than this? Is it worth renting the movie?

oh fer pete's sake just go rent it. its a good movie and theres no need for anyone here to muck it up trying to explain it.

That's for me to decide, isn't it? Give me a brief summary of the plot, or don't.

is it possible for women to synch with other women on the internet? menstrually, that is. just wondering.

Dave, you bitch, please ask Agatha to answer my question.

LOL!!!

it's good, spider. but it sounds like you saw most of it.

Actually, I only saw it from the time he was in prison. It seemed like an OK movie...I would imagine that much was edited out. (Too bad they didn't edit out the shower rape scene. I was eating sausages when it came on.) Maybe I'll rent it some day.

for chrissakes, spider.. what do sausages have to do with prison sex?

i thought it was pretty good, spider, but i agree that the ending was weak. it's worth it just to see the chest on that mother. whoo-wee!