2 Bunker Busters$36,400,000 Saddam Hussein hauled away on a stretcher, priceless. |
$310,000,000 wasted on an assasination attempt: fuck you. |
Lending it to Trace - free Him using it to kiss Bush's hairy balls - $1,000 in therapy for me to recover from the ickiness. |
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somebody scoop the cat box. |
there's your "Saddam on a stretcher" you sick fuck. |
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http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&u=/030323/168/3lley.html&e=4&ncid=996 Baghdad. the body count continues. and the dumbass in the whitehouse says this may take longer than some originally thought. fucking liar. he gives you the feeling, like a contractor you just hired to build your house for 1 million, then says "oh you mean you wanted us to use wood....ohhhhhh thats going to be another 2 mil." just wait till we get to baghdad. then the bodies will really pile up. wmd's my ass. |
"Saddam had tailors stitch up 15,000 British and American uniforms so that disguised Iraqi troops could attack Iraqi civilians, allowing Saddam to blame the allies. The enormous antiwar demonstrations in the West prior to the fighting may have emboldened Saddam into thinking the Americans could be made to fold. " Also, know this for an absolute fact: The Republican Guard has planted explosives in the civilian areas and on bridges Iraqi civilian would use to leave an area that is under attack. The biggest weapon in Iraq's and America's arsenal is this: Propoganda. We have spent BILLIONS on making sure our missiles are guided, not just "dumb" bombs. Again you are proving your willingness to beleive what ever comes out against the United States. We are fighting him with convential weapons. He knows he cannot beat our weapons. So they use psychological warfare. They use propaganda. And it's working, obviously. They parade dead US soldiers, US soldiers being executed, little girls killed by who knows, honestly. |
down with bush! hooray saddam! praise saddam! |
dirty lefty conspiracy! they are obviously being terrorized and destoryed by the tyranny of american munitions! evil empire, we!!! |
oh, arent we the happy, warm fuzzy invading forces. we won't really know the truth for sometime. so, you know, im not discounting what the Iraqi army has done trace. I would expect a portion of their populus, despite what we think of their living conditions, to fight the invaders. We are an invading force you'd fight too if you were being invaded. you use whatever you have at your disposal. its called guerilla warfare. whatever tactics necessary. its war. its ugly, people die. there is no more or no less nobility in using similar looking uniforms to gain an upperhand just as there is no more or less nobility than firing million dollar rockets from 100s of miles away and calling your actions brave "Again you are proving your willingness to beleive what ever comes out against the United States." um. no. but rather my willingness to disbelieve whatever is fed to us from the mothership. its not like they've earned my trust or anything. |
Plus other examples from Vietnam of government/military lying to the public. |
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Vietnam is also a great supply of Newspeak: "we had to destroy the village in order to save it" |
i'm not defendeding any action, but really- focusing on the honesty of the government as proof of anything doesn't make sence. do americans eat healthy diets? do americans manage well their personal finances? where americans have all the information and full choice, they make wrong decisions all the time. they are incapable of understanding simple concepts, so why should anyone assume they'd make right decisions on anything a complex as geopolitical relations? add further that due to national security there is definitely information that cannot be broadcast to the general public. how can you expect americans, who in the general case cannot make good decisions when given all the information, to make good decisions given a fraction of the information? one of the fundamental purposes of government is to protect the interests of its nation- safety and freedom. the public cannot always understand or even know the reasons behind actions the government must take to accomplish this. this why we have a representative government. you elect someone to make these decisions for you. you elect them for their character, and you expect them, once in office, to make these decisions for you. does this always work? of course not, because we have the same group of americans deciding who to elect as we do running their creditcards into the ground and eating value meals six days a week. but shit, where's the alternative? |
maybe if we spent less on bombs used in wars built oh a foundation of lies and more on education, we might have a public that can eat better, finance better and understand geopolitical situations better. you know this isnt about sensitive information that could compromise security. this is about forgeries, lack of evidence and mistruths about who has committed what to the US used to propel and justify our actions. i dunno, when handing out ultimate fates to our troops, their troops and innocent civilians, i would expect the high rope to be walked. it seems we've reached a new low in actually justifying our aggression. |
sometimes you need to tell children about santa to get them to be good for a few weeks. the american people are children. frankly, most of us don't want the burden of knowing what is really going on. i sure don't. it isn't about education. find me someone who doesn't know a big mac a day isn't going to do you well. i can definitely find you five who do know and eat greasy crap daily anyway. the average joe is an average joe. you need public support, you need to give the average joe something he can get behind. this is what happens. no amount of education is going to change the inherent ability of average joe to understand. this war isn't built on a foundation of lies. public opinion of it might be. utopia isn't possible. evil exists. |
a compelling argument for what is happening. this war IS built around lies but you know what id say, so I wont bother. when it comes to the big mac juxtoposition you pose, the *pleasure* derived from the meaty goodness and special sauce override the rationale that says this isnt good for us. what exactly is "tasty" about this war? Are you saying average joe's desire to rally around the god damn flagpole is it? there is no satisfication such as that of a new credit card or a super-sized meal from what is happening, or if there is, Its completely foreign to me. i dont deny that i lack the forsight to the burden of truth but still... |
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patty- the big mac isn't an analogy for the war. babyfood is an analogy for the war- babies don't understand that they need what's in the baby food. hell, they can't understand. it is beyond a baby's comprehension that a variety of less-than-tasty mush is the best thing for them. and yea, that analogy falls apart, but you get the idea. the big mac is proof that people aren't smart enough to think for themselves. i think this war is important for the economic security of the US. i think this has many facets, and i won't pretend to know any of them. would you have been pro-nuking japan in WWII? would anyone who is protesting this war have been? yet, those bombs and those casualties saved many times more lives. i wouldn't have understood the all the elements of the situation at the time. i would have been against nuking japan. i would have been wrong. |
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Well, since we can only speculate the cost in lives of a ground war in Japan, we can only guess at how many lives were saved by using the bomb. (Unless you're talking about American lives only. Obviously no Americans were lost in the blast [though it did destroy the lives of the men who dropped the bomb, in another way].) Furthermore, the bombs killed and injured nearly 100,000 civilian men, women, and children, while a ground war would have targeted mainly those men on both sides who had signed up to be there. So, basically, I would have protested the use of the A-bomb before the war, and I still challenge the ethics of its use ~60 years later. History doesn't always lift the veil over the implication of events. |
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Amen |
The struggle you see us in now would probably have been much worse then. There would be more US and Iraqi deaths, including civilians. But fewer would have called it an Unjust war. |
you mean the thumbs up to invade Kuwait? Because thats what happened. Its been well reported we knew he was going to invade, that we would allow him to invade. So what exactly did we start 12 years ago? |
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so did we start the "liberation" or did we actually start the invasion by allowing it to happen only to act like we were caught off guard to and lead such a noble coalition of liberation. are you telling me you believe that we had no friggin clue that Iraq was massing 100s of thousands of troops on the border and we didnt know about it? c'mon. we knew. we allowed it. we gave saddam the double cross. in the end, America has since had a solid concrete military footing in the middle east. |
Um, see. Blame America First. OK... |
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there has been discussion over the years, granted outside your CNN world of things, that Bush Sr. knew what was going on. im posing questions, not necessarily making statements. i have a hard time accepting we didnt know his intentions. i have a hard time accepting that we saw his build up on the border and then acted entirely caught off guard when he did invade. by saying "blame America first" you imply that i rule without even considering the alternative which is entirely not the case. Please. Give that angle up. Its unfounded, you sound stupid using it and it just has no bearing. Some interesting ideas on the Kuwait invasion |
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cause its been said many Muslims didnt want us there, they wanted to fight their own battles, at least on the Saudi side of things. where do you think a major source of contention against the US (outside the Saudi oil business) lies? |
Oh, and France and Germany. And Baghdad |
Otherwise, I'm with Spider. The use of nuclear weapons was a horrendous act and nothing will ever make it anything but. |
try US airbases in Saudi Arabia, some the most revered land in the Muslim. |
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