THIS IS A READ-ONLY ARCHIVE FROM THE SORABJI.COM MESSAGE BOARDS (1995-2016). |
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I know I've spoken at length in the past about the oppression of arabs in Israel. This is what we fund: http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/world/middle_east/newsid_952000/952600.stm |
Im done with those fuckers too, jewish or not. Sending that hardliner into the west bank like that was a provocation.....rocks vs bullets doesn't add up. i got your back, and i share your anger. |
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I get angry when any innocent bystander is killed--an ambulance driver for chrissakes. Fucking sick. |
israel's lobby in congress is larger than any other nation's. |
Barak countered by saying in a statement that only ''strident decisions and measures'' by Arafat ``can bring an end to the violence and bloodshed.'' the dead so far: 48 palestinians and israeli arabs (mostly civilian?) 3 israeli jews (1 civilian) |
Half of these people forget the real reason they were fighting in the first place ( not that it was a good reason.) Now they they kill each other on principle, and what can we do... Umm, nothing. I agree stop this funding bullshit, if it means that me and my whole fucking nation is labeled antisemites, then fine so be it... I personally will not stand behind the murder of little kids, that just isn't fucking right, not that I have much say in the matter, I'm just an 18 year old in the middle of a state the rest of our country consiters cowpoked... People suck. |
What's going in Jerusalem now went on here until pretty recently. |
every time there is a mass movement from a paticular area to another area, it almost always results in hostile takeover. why can't people just sit down and talk things over before they escalate to these stages? whoever has expirienced "death by listening"? |
I hate it when your parents just won't listen. When will they grow up? |
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what a farce. |
The debates made me unhappy. I wasn't really impressed with either candidate, and while I didn't expect to be, it still made me sad. I felt that none of the issues were addresses my satisfaction. Really, both candidates are horrid, and that's the way it is. Some of them made points I sort of liked, but overall the debates sounded awful. I don't want either of these men leading my nation. |
What fucks, man if we did that when I was in debate back in highschool our coach would have killed us... I noticed that those pompus bastards couldn't help but bounce back and forth between lipping at each other, and talking about taxes... JESUS, I learned more about bad mouthing in a nice way, and taxes lastnight then I ever wanted to know. |
with education, he could have called down bush's plan for "accountability" by simply asking him how we can hold educators accountable when they havent been given a fair chance with the poor state of school facilities. there are two more debates, Israel will make it into one of them. on the whole foreign policy has taken a back seat this year, it's all about social welfare. |
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the point of the debate is to make sure nobody looks bad. |
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But luckily what I think doesn't matter a whole lot. |
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people who bother to look into issues that matter usually don't vote. and when they do, they vote on basis of issues that matter. |
Here, you get fined for not voting, so it makes a silent protest so much more effective and meaningless. On your side of the rock, it could just appear to be pure laziness. |
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i'm a spliffocrat. |
she makes a lot more sense than these windbags (when she's civil). |
Both also ducked the fact that Social Security will go bankrupt, no matter what. And the Nader fiasco - I thought that there was no better way to show how screwed up and biased and fake the debates are. Nader didn't even have a ticket to the actual debate, but to an alternate viewing area, and they threatened to arrest him if he tried to get in. God Bless America, Land of the Free, huh? Gore missed a lot of opportunities to rail Bush on issues such as poverty, although he's vulnerable there as well. And with all the talk about presctiption drugs, I guess it's not important that there are 46 million people in this country who have no medical insurance at all. Meet the new boss, same as the old boss. |
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He denies making these kinds of statements (lie) and then goes on to talk about his middle-class tax cut plan (lie). he has no middle class tax cut plan. it goes on and on. just assume the man is lying and you'll be right most of the time. |
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and the whole temple fundraiser thing. the guy is a shifty bastard. |
i can't wait 'til 11/5, whatever the outcome, only because everyone will start shutting up about it. i feel the same way about pro sports playoff time. actually, i see little difference between the elections and play-offs. why do all of you humans care about what happens to people who don't give a rat's ass about you? |
we like competition man. |
the liar or the bumpkin. it doesn't matter. we are a slow moving democracy. |
i guess that's ok for most people but i feel like an idiot when i catch myself paying too much attention to people don't know me and don't want to know me (i.e nearly everyone in the world). |
whether you like it or not, the presidency can have an effect on your life. |
election year makes even relatively intelligent people sound like fucking morons. anyway. as if it matters which one of these chuckleheads gets elected to be CEO of America, inc. me? i'm going back to sleep. wake me up when the apocalypse starts. |
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he sits on the corner of my duchess. |
Bush lies. Take his military service. For an entire YEAR he didn't report for duty to the Texas National Guard. This is well documented. He worked in Alabama on political campains. Yet he constantly talks about his "honerable" service. He denied any consideration to a death row inmate who had a chance of being acquitted (because his public defender slept through parts of the trial!) but gave a 30 day reprieve to a man who only had a 1 in 58 billion chance of having his DNA evidence refuted. Is this very honest? So, to characterize Bush as honest is, well, pretty idiotic. I'd rather have a president who can think for longer than two minutes before getting distracted or forgetful. |
but gore is the tricky one. he's not stupid. that makes him demonic. |
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Nate, media mouthpiece. Who woulda thunk it? |
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Lieberman is a democrat, and not to be trusted. |
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Nate, media mouthpiece. Who woulda thunk it? ---- news to me. if i categorically aligned myself opposite of the media, that would be as simpleminded as categorically aligning myself with them. so what's up antigone? you need to get laid or something? you've been kind of bitchy. |
But I'm bitchy because you hit on a pet peeve, that's all. I guess I just heard the "Gore is a liar and Bush is a nice guy" line one time too many. I'd expect to read that in one of Trace's posts, ya know? :-P |
i only brought it up because around here (my physical around here) most people are all for gore. they miss out on the important details. you can't trust a man just because he wears jeans on mtv. or writes a book about the environment. |
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<alldaymusic@agoron.com> Received: from tao.agoron.com ([206.181.233.66]) by walker.mail.mindspring.net (Mindspring Mail Service) with ESMTP id su1hgt.228h.37kbi73 for <blindswine@mindspring.com>; Sun, 8 Oct 2000 15:08:13 -0400 (EDT) Received: from cc474101-a (rem46.agoron.com [207.86.97.177]) by tao.agoron.com (8.9.3/8.9.3) with SMTP id PAA23593; Sun, 8 Oct 2000 15:07:12 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <001301c0315b$0710cb60$b16156cf@cc474101-a.jrsycty1.nj.home.com> From: "alldaymusic" <alldaymusic@agoron.com> To: "Edison" <edisonian@netzero.net>, "Vikki Michalios" <michaliosdesigns@aol.com>, "Soloist" <soloist_1@hotmail.com>, "Yssa Bobrow" <yssa@bellatlantic.net>, "Wayne McLamb" <wamjams@aol.com>, "Triana" <Mibellatri@aol.com>, "Suzanne Persechino" <suzanne.persechino@bbdo.com>, "Suheir Hammad" <butterphoenix@yahoo.com>, <stevestrunsky@nytimes.com>, "Steve Mcintyre" <smcintyre@alltex-ny.com>, "Steve Marlowe" <stevepm@yahoo.com>, "Slany, Frank" <FSlany@fcc.net>, "Sforza, Domenica" <domenica.sforza@msnbc.com>, "Ron Thompson" <ronnyron@aol.com>, "Reg E Gaines" <dwbreg@aol.com>, Subject: More Words Date: Sun, 8 Oct 2000 15:07:11 -0400 MIME-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: multipart/alternative; boundary="----=_NextPart_000_0010_01C03139.6F4BA820" X-Priority: 3 X-MSMail-Priority: Normal X-Mailer: Microsoft Outlook Express 4.72.3110.1 X-MimeOLE: Produced By Microsoft MimeOLE V4.72.3110.3 X-Mozilla-Status: 8001 X-Mozilla-Status2: 00000000 X-UIDL: su1hgt.228h.37kbi73 I received an e-mail from my friend Suheir. Many (on this list) may remember her from "What's in a Word?", just over a week ago. Since then, Suheir has been affected in thought, emotion and action by the conflict in Palestine. Here are her words: I remember now what it means to be a Palestinian. This cramped scrambling from station to station in search of better sharper newer footage. Mid-East Mayhem. Jerusalem Rage. Peace Derailed. What is the media calling genocide this half-hour? I remember what genocide is. If before they were shot down in the streets like wild dogs the dead had been throwing rocks bricks shooting crippled Russian ammunition even smuggled in second hand Israeli weaponry; it is still a massacre. What? We are only to sympathize with those who hand their murderers guns and lay down for them? What? We are to believe news anchors floating in the hype hatred built? We are to understand anti-tank missiles fired into buildings crowds into families and bodies? People are not tanks. This image will haunt all those who view it. A child crouched and caught in crossfire. A terror through him no one living can fathom. A fear particular to the last minutes of a twelve-year-old life. I remember what it would mean to be a mother. My abdomen cramped in disbelief. Rami looking for protection under his father’s arm. Screaming and holding his hands over his ears. Arms trembling akimbo. So loud the shooting and the guns and the Hebrew Arabic French English - the language of death around him. His little heart bruised his ribs beating so hard. His feet under him - unable to run to walk to dig a cover to hide in. His father reduced to a human shield begging. And we watched this little boy murdered. And heard the justifications and the dragging of feet over his blood on the ground. Even the ambulance driver who ran to reach him was killed. Remind me what it means to be human. When we spend money on films to scare us and sex to drive us. When we jump from amusement rides for a rush and buy glitter to camouflage. Remind me what we are supposed to do to be after we witness this. Not how we get up and go to work to school to bed. But why. And fuck an eye for an eye. The body of a twelve-year-old Israeli boy will not equal one freckle on Rami's cheek. The killings have not stopped even as I begin to write this five days after French television focused a lens on a father and son backed into a wall. Who knew they would capture forever on film what it means to be a species bent on self-destruction? The killing off of our young. I remember Palestine. And Sierra Leone Bosnia Rwanda the American South Algeria the Trail of Tears. I remember Auschwitz the Congo Lebanon Cambodia. The names of nations have never been beautiful enough for poems. The names of martyrs have always been too numerous for poems. Remind me who God is. Who God is supposed to be and why I'm supposed to believe in anything other than war. From now on dead children are my God. I will pray to them and petition them for forgiveness and declare crusades in their names. I remember what it feels to be twelve and unable to run from men's aggressions. But I am here. We are here. And we are altered. What it means to be alive has shifted. The paradigm is not the same. Sparing a dime shedding a tear not enough. I remember Rami. But not the way his siblings will. Not the way his father will once he regains consciousness. Not the way his mother will, or the boys who will come after him hungry and fed on vengeance. I will remember him when I pray because it will be in his name. I will remember him when I look at you because God is in everyone. I will remember him when I go to work to school to bed because God is in the daily. I will remember him when I write because God is in the details. I will remember this little boy murdered in Palestine by those who do not believe in God; the story on repeat two thousand years after a carpenter was crucified for his magic. I will remember him when I cry because tears are not enough. I will remember him when I have a choice between fear and strength, which is really love, and God is love. And I will choose God. I will remember that last minute of Rami's life. When he was cramped scrambling from one face to another. Searching for mercy. |
they all gab gab gab about peace, yet people are dying. I think the international community needs to step in, before all of Mesopotamia is at war. and for some fucked up reason i could see that happening. Im not advocating military intervention at all. Rather UN isolation, international ostrasizing. I could however see Lebanon stepping up border attacks. Other Arab countries start funding Palestinian efforts, US, playing "mediator" is called to come to the rescue of poor little Israel, getting their asses kicked by every neighbor they have. |
then you look at the death toll.. 90+% palestinian. Isaiah 17:1-4 An oracle concerning Damascus: "See, Damascus will no longer be a city but will become a heap of ruins. The cities of Aroer will be deserted and left to flocks, which will lie down, with no one to make them afraid. The fortified city will disappear from Ephraim, and royal power from Damascus; the remnant of Aram will be like the glory of the Israelites," declares the LORD Almighty. |
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that UN vote recently, the vote critical of Israel's actions. Where the US abstained from voting so as to maintain our impartial status. you know, so that we can continue to moderate the conflict. this was reported on some news broadcasts as the US not vetoing the issue. the assumption that the US would veto, the idea that at least one news organization, or even just one news writer, feels that everything in israel is hunky-dory. disgusting. disgusting. i had a daydream today. i was this invincible freedom fighter. i charmed my way onto a flight to the mid-east with a duffel full of high tech laser machine guns. when i was younger i used to have dreams about going back into ancient civilizations with a load of modern machine guns and explosives. kicking ass for underdog. In the future they'd have a G I Joe Centurian Spartacus doll marketed on my memory. so that's what my duffel full of weapons was. the equivilent of sending a modern fully armed Navy Seal back to the days of bronze spears heads, except the weapons are from a day far in the future, the back to the days is back to now. i fucking fly through the rubble and twisted flaming vehicles. i fight for the underdog. keep the big bad men from shooting twelve year olds throwing rocks. my armor blocks anything they shoot at me. my shots never miss. i am in perfect control. my judgement is law. i become emperor. the christians think i am the second coming of christ. the muslims think i am the ressurection of mohammad. the jews convert to bhuddism. i drink beer and smoke weed. i become a curtain of men. a fractal god with more heads than a painting in the back of a hare krishna cookbook. i shed the bark around my soul. i breathe fire. my mind escapes in a flash of light, streaming into the night air like a comet. my body collapses and shatters as if deeply frozen. each tiny bit places its face in its hands and weeps my tears. i am elsewhere. i feel nothing. nothing reaches around my chest, my belly, the tops of my legs. curves up, slinking tendrils about my genitals and into my rectum. absent reality, an inverted fog where the something bunches up, vacuating my intestine, my stomach, my throat. with a pop my lungs are unfilled, the nothing passes my larnyx (i say nothing) and excapes my mouth. my head is trusted into itless. nothing. i recognize that i am something in nothing. surrounded by nothing. unfilled by nothing. a bubble of something. but just me, away from this place. something in nothing. i was everything. because this here is everything, and it is impossible to 'cross nothing' to get to something else, then this everything is bounded by nothing. so when i was it. all that was bounded by nothing. i was everything. everything without boundry. infinite. to be bounded by nothing is to be infinite. this is not sematics. the square is the circle. once it is seen, unsee it and then pop. like lungs unfilling. pop. pop! pop! you find yourself no longer surrounded by everything, or even anything, but by nothing. and thus surrounded by nothing, you are everything. a bubble of something. finite and yet infinite. like one to infinity is an infinity, bounded on one side. how many digits fall between one and infinity? an infinite number. how many digits fall between zero and infinity? surely more than the former. and negative infinity to positive infinity? twice as much as even that? but what is two times infinity? how many divisions can be made between zero and one? how many infinities are contained within an inch of hair? bounded on all sides?! so there you are, bounded by nothing. you are infinite, though moments before you were resting in the space of another everything. another infinite, and you, you were a tiny subset. i am. i am a tiny subset. and yet, i am infinite. it's right there, on the edge of what i understand. a way to snap your brain over and suddenly it is more. more reality. the adjustable sliding infinity. the distance beyond which our everything is contained as we are contained within our everything. the nothing absolves. falls away. neither potential nor kenetic, but the opposite of both. when i was a child, perhaps 6 or 7, i pushed myself up from lying on my chest. first i pushed into the typical pushup structure. then lifted on leg, then one hand (balancing on one hand and one toe.) but then, i lifted the other toe, leaving me balanced perpendicular to my arm, parallel to the ground, on one hand. then, i pushed up onto one finger. and then i levitated. perhaps an inch from the tip of my finger to solid ground. i was there for about 20 seconds. then i collapsed to the ground. i told my best friend this in jr. high. he told me about how he once thought he could walk through screen doors, but then one day experimentally discovered that he could not. he ended up going to M.I.T. fucking A if he didn't. and in those days we'd pick our powers to be invisibility. the places you could go if your were invisible. fuck. but not anymore. today i'd pick the future weapons and invincible armor. and go kick some ass for the underdog. |
IN 1989 I SPENT 39 DAYS IN TEL AVIV-ASHKALON-HAIFA-AND JERUSALEUM THESE ARE THINGS I REMEMBER ON ARRIVING IN TEL AVIV AND SEEING THE BEAUTIFUL BLUE WATERS THAT LAY JUST UPON MY HOTEL WINDOW/HEARING THE SOUNDS OF GUNFIRE GOING OFF IN THE NOT TOO FAR DISTANCE/DILAPIDATED SCHOOL BUSES CARRYING TOY BOY AND GIRL SOLDIERS WHO LUGGED AROUND 16 MM's WHILE SNACKING ON FRENCH FRIES THEY HAD JUST BOUGHT FROM McDONALDS/STARING IN AMAZEMENT WHEN A SMALL BROWN PAPER BAG LEFT UN-ATTENDED AT A BUS STOP CAUSED THE COMPLETE EVACUATION OF A TEN BLOCK RADIUS AND THE CALM AND ALMOST ROUTINE ORDER IN WHICH THE PEOPLE DISPERSED/CLIMBING ON A BUS FOR A SHORT RIDE TO A TENNIS COMPLEX AND WATCHING TINY FIGURES, FACES COVERED WITH HANDKERCHIEFS AND BANDANAS, FLINGING ROCKS WITH DEADLY ACCURACY AS AN ARMY DROVE SLOWLY BELOW THE TERRACES OF THEIR MAKESHIFT CONDOS WHICH LOOKED AS IF THEY HAD BEEN CARVED INTO THE SIDE OF THE MOUNTAIN/POVERTY AND MORE POVERTY AND FRESH, BROWN BREAD AND LITTLE BOYS, NONE TALLER THAN FIVE FOOT SIX ASKING IF I WERE KAREEM ABDHUL JABBAR EVEN THOUGH I AM ONLY FIVE FOOT SEVEN AND THE HEAVENLY EYES OF THE PALESTINIAN WOMAN I SAW WHEN WALKING THROUGH THE HOLY CITY FULL OF FEAR WHEN I SAW ARABS AND JEWS SIDE BY SIDE AND I WANTED TO RUN AND HIDE BECAUSE I KNEW IT WOULD ERUPT INTO WAR UNTIL I WAS INFORMED EVERYONE ACTED COOL IN THE HOLY CITY WHICH MADE ME WONDER WHY AND HOW AND WHEN THE FIGHTING WOULD END BECAUSE THEY WERE FIGHTING THEN AND NOW THEY'RE FIGHTING AGAIN AND I DON'T BLAME ANYONE BUT I BLAME EVERYONE INCLUDING ME BECAUSE AS SOON AS I HEARD THE NEWS, SAW THE WOUNDS, I IMMEDIATELY TOOK SIDES AND I'M HALF A WORLD AWAY AND DON'T KNOW WHAT TO SAY TO SUHEIR OR BARAK OR ARAFAT OR WHAT IN THE WORLD IS ANYONE FIGHTING FOR BECAUSE IF THERE IS NO HEAVEN AND YOU DIE FOR A CAUSE WHICH YOU BELIEVE WILL HELP YOU GET TO THAT PLACE OF DIVINE SPIRITUALITY THEN ALL THE FIGHTING IS FOR NAUGHT AND WE ARE ALL DOOMED AND I CRY OUT FOR SUHEIR'S PAIN BECAUSE SHE KNOWS AND SMELLS AND TASTES THE TEARS SHED BY BABY'S AND BEGGARS AND BODYGUARDS FOR FANCY SUITS AND BIG BLACK CARS WHO USE THE RIGHT FORK AND SAY THE RIGHT THINGS AND BRUSH THEIR TEETH AND WIPE THEIR ASS LIKE YOU AND ME AND ISN'T IT ABOUT BEING FREE TO DO THAT WHICH MAKES EVERYONE HAPPY MAKES EVERYONE DREAM OF PEACE... TO SUHEIR HAMMAD FROM REG E GAINES MUCH LOVE AND PEACE AND HAPPINESS AND HOPE YOU SLEEP WELL DESPITE ALL THE CRAZINESS OF THIS VERY STRANGE, STRANGE WORLD... |
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i was also sipping jagermiester, which i used to think was ass but am now reevaluating. |
can't do the liquorice , it just turns me wrong |
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there are fish in this one, too, dougie. |
what-ever. go nate go |
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