| THIS IS A READ-ONLY ARCHIVE FROM THE SORABJI.COM MESSAGE BOARDS (1995-2016). |
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anyone who has the capacity to kidnap 3 girls, slay 2 children including strangling an infant plus kill a couple of adults deserves something more than our justice system could ever exact. becoming a father really has changed my perspective on these things. |
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yup, kill him. end him. game over. i think we should kill these guys "pinata/ton of bricks" style. stake them out, give any close friend or family member of the victim(s) 3 swings to anywhere but the head with a bludgeon, and then drop a large amount of rocks, boulders, bricks, stuff like that on 'em from about 20 or 30 feet up. just leave the pile there. |
id be perfectly happy if this were a"dave-sponsored" execution. my "conviction" being that its pretty clear he did what he did is enough for me, at least in this instance. really though. im speaking out of emotion, to be sure. but i think there's a silent happiness we would all share if the arresting officers' guns somehow misfired and happen to hit this pig in the belly and somehow the police cruiser broke down, in a part of rurual mountainous North GA that was barely accessible by vehicle and an Medi-Vac chopper was over 3 hours away. |
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charged. convicted. whatever. go have a cute little kid and talk to us. |
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it doesnt matter to me if one is more capable of defending themselves than the other. murder is murder. if you're emotionally attached to one group then...obviously you see different. I'unno. most of North America has a child worship thing going on. I dont. I still hate kids. i cant even pretend to like them either. So obviously I'm no more detested when a kid gets killed than when anyone else is. To be honest, I'm one of those types that's more shocked by tales of pet abuse than the killing of other people. Guess I'm just too used to the latter. meh. sad. I've been even more conflicted with this type of situation since I saw the documentary "Stevie" the other day. its about this, well, redneck i guess I'll say so you get the picture, who grew up without parents and was sexually abused as a child.. and his former "big brother" (this is the same guy who shot Hoop Dreams) comes back to town to see him and see what has happened with his life since he left to make movies. Stevie just a while later gets charged with sexually molesting an 8 year old girl, and the rest of the documentary kinda follows the process of him awaiting his trial and possible prison time. And it never makes any excuses for him or tries to pass the blame on to anyone else and make him look like the victim. They know he did what he did and how bad it was and that he should actually go to prison or whatnot, but they still love him and are trying to help him and understand the reality of it rather than just say "monster" and be rid of him. Even if you have kids, I think anyone would be really confused about what to think after seeing it. |
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like. i dont wanna hear nothing about no death penalty. i dont want to hear nothing about no being innocent until proven guilty. and i especially don't wanna hear if from some one who cites more invoked sadness from animal abuse stories than child abuse stories. you needs your head checked. havent you ever watched a movie and felt satiated when the bad guy gets creamed by the good guy? do you shove a stick in your ass and start question the emotional enjoyment you jsut experienced by wondering if he was proven guilty and offered a fair trial by jury? jesus christ man. i also dont believe anyone who says they hate kids. so. yes. im calling your bluff. i think its all a front when people are that adamant about not liking kids. im not talking about having kids of your own. i just think the emotional need to come out and say as such is telling. shit. this thread is gonna get all serious and shit now. god dammit. hey dave i like the brick/pinata idea. ive had a torture method in my head for sometime that involved a tree stump, forest fire, staple guns, your nutsack and a plastic knife. a bit more invloved. maybe. but i like your looney toon inspired idea. it could be wiley coyote under those bricks. |
run! run away! |
You can call whatever but I still seriously hate kids. I have my reasons. telling? telling of what? |
He confessed to his ex wife. Good enough for me. Nuke 'im. |
rowlfe, you got some lord of the flies story for us? |
I worked at both WalMart and a toy store for extra money during college as a front end cashier. Thats Lord of the Flies enough... |
shit. |
just a personal preference. Expressing a strong like or dislike of something as part of a conversation is normal. |
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Like mustard, relish, unmelted cheese, most anime, bees, dressing rooms, and peach juice. My dislike of children is on the level of say, "Trading Spaces" marathons, Insane Clown Posse, or my Aunt Lois. As in, I dont just avoid them. I avoid the shit out of them! and when I inevitably come into contact with one of these things, I get a shiver in my spine and something goes off in my ears that is the equivalent of nails on a chalkboard. |
A kid who's calm and non-hostile is neutral at worst, great fun at best....just like an adult. Go see "In America" -- the two little girls are great examples of great kids. |
not liking wool sweaters is indeed a preference. not liking deviled eggs is a preference. disliking an entire segment of the population ....it just seems an immature thing to say. i mean c'mon, its not that bad rowlf. jesus christ. you dont get shivers in your spine and hear nails on chalk every time you come near kids. stop exagerrating. i know the mentality. i used to say it. its not like having a child changed that. it was a gradual thing that started well before eva was ever in the picture. i mean. really. i could careless. |
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I bet if rowlfe had a kid he'd change his mind and realize that he really just hates bad parents. |
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People justify. Evolution can be used to explain intolerance, yes. It can also just as easily be used to explain tolerance. (Keeping a diverse gene pool, etc.) Most interesting is how it could describe the balance or interaction between tolerance and intolerance. Better yet it could explain how this relationship changes over time. |
Ha! You too Rowlfe? I don't know what it is about that show that makes my skin crawl -- probably the stupid music they play when they fastframe through the entire renovation process, and that annoying host Paige Somethingorother to whom I'd like to do what Patrick wants to do with the child killer above. Although there is one designer (the one who always goes barefoot) who is awfully hot. Unfortunately, the wifey loves that show, so I make myself scarce when that crap's on. |
not every time. but most of the time. more specifically, the younger kids are the less I like them. With a kid around 7 and up I can maybe show them stuff or play games. I'd be a good uncle, and I'd be interested in maybe helping shape my sisters' kids if and when they have them. But with babies and toddlers, I am seriously pretty disgusted with everything about them. Everything about their appearance, their smell, their noises. Sincerely, they drive me nuts. And they all look the same to me so I cant get excited for a friends kid or whatever. If they're too young to remember me, I have no interest. I have a BIG family, with literally dozens of cousins, most of which have kids now. My mom shows me the baby pictures and stuff (they mainly all live out east save a few who live in Ontario), and I honestly dont remember any of their names or how old any of them are now. If I had one cousin or relative or friend with a baby maybe it would mean something to me, but really, theres just way too many to care at all. "I bet if rowlfe had a kid he'd change his mind and realize that he really just hates bad parents" one thing retail taught me is that a lot of kids arent raised bad, a lot of them actually ARE just born bad, and some of these awful traits arent learned, they're just part of human nature. For example, I see kids that are like, less than 3, barely able to speak, but they know what they want. When a toy is taken away from them, or their parent says they cant have something, and they just scream and wail and somehow one of the phrases they actually know is "I WANT IT I WANT IT I WANT IT"... it convinced me that this greed is just part of us, it isnt learned... and I could go on, there's lots of other things I cant blame the parents for. when a kid 8 and older is bad I usually blame the parents. Under that, I assume the kid is from hell. |
i don't like little kids in the same way that i don't like dogs, and for many of the same reasons: I don't find them cute or endearing in the least. Not one tiny bit. Ever. They're messy and loud, if they're not loud now, they can get loud qickly and without warning. They lack control of important bodily functions. They're unpredictable. You have to clean up their shit. And they turn any female within 10 yards into a squealing, babbling moron. So that's why i don't want a child, or a dog. But y'all can squeeze out as many kids and/or dogs as you'd like. Have fun. I don't like them when they're angels, and i don't like them when they're trolls. Right across the board- I just don't like them. It's a preference. It's okay. |
I'm pretty mean about people I know who end up getting kids. Behind their back wisper and I might make some "breeders" comment and shake our heads, sad about how their choice to raise a family is going to change them and how we probably wont see them much anymore. I am really mean. Some of them I actually find selfish, like they decided to have a kid like they would decide to get a TV or a car. but I think that has a lot to do with how much I think people should adopt instead, seeing unwanted children as a much larger crime than an aborted one. likewise, I am probably just as intolerant with friends who make poor decisions in who they make their girlfriend. More than a few friends have gone and become totally whipped with a humorless, 'normal' person and wont hang out with us anymore because their girlfriend doesnt understand why we thought "Kick in the Cunt" was funny and therefore finds us to be a bad influence on the man they are going to shape into a future father and provider. I am a quite shun-able, baby-hating semi-misogynist. Which reminds me. You know how they say pictures steal your soul? Is this why women like to take pictures so much? |
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oh yes. this is a big reason why I hate young ones. For what they turn others into. You can be hanging out with a bunch of people, but if someone with a baby shows up, all conversation and such becomes focused about the child. On my last birthday me and my best friend since the age of 4, who share the same birthday, we had a simple humble backyard barbecue with friends. But one guy who showed up brought his girlfriend and his new baby boy. So his girlfriend goes off nearby and plays with the kid and the rest of us continue our talks and jokes and whatever. But every once in a while the girlfriend would yell over to us about something cute the kid did, and we would quickly acknowledge and get back to talking. Over time she basically DEMANDED that attention be placed upon the child and then brought the kid to the table for us to play with and talk about. It was unbearable and wispy and I made an excuse and left. |
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i think Rowlf and Anti would have a swell time together. |
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My dog rules too. I dislike people who don't like kids. Just saying. |
I dislike saying. Kids just don't like people. |
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This is part of natural human development. When you're first born, you're just a passive ball of needs, unable to fulfill any of them yourself because you don't have the mental ability to search for food/comfort/etc, the muscle tone to move, the judgment to determine what's beneficial and what's dangerous, etc. You are utterly dependent on your caretakers for survival. As you grow older, you gain mobility, language, memory, cognitive processing skills, etc. Most people begin to develop rudimentary empathy at toddler stage, as well. However, as you're still a larva and still can't cross the road without help, and as you're still in the process of learning that other people have mental states/feelings/needs that differ from yours, you're still 99% self-focused. You are all id, if you will. It's the parents' task to socialize you and help you develop an ego and, later, a superego. (Freud may have been shady in other regards, but he was on to something here.) It is completely unreasonable to expect a 3-year-old to think and function at the level of an adult, or older child. It's very interesting to be around children and watch them physically and cognitively. If you can't bring yourself to enjoy kids' company, you can always observe them to determine what stage of development they're at. And they can so be cute. For example: Last night, I was with my best friend and her family...her youngest sister Catherine is 8, and the family was telling stories about her after she had gone to bed. One day when she was around 5, she and her mother were listening to Stevie Wonder in the car. Catherine really liked the music and said he must be a very attractive man. She's always been boy-crazy. Anyway, her mother told her he was and he was also blind. Catherine's response? "Oh! That's why he says 'where has all my love gone?'" Now, come on. That is funny. |
I dont expect them to. I just dont like it, dont want to be around it and dont want to have one of my own to go through that. Basically, every stage of raising a kid... I dont want. I dont think most kids, even good ones, really care about their parents on a level that makes it worth my own time, effort and moolah. Is that selfish? Maybe, but I see having kids as selfish in many respects anyway, so bleh. "Now, come on. That is funny" if he was animated or a Muppet I might have chuckled. Naivety and innocence is funny, but I can get that from a variety of other sources. I notice that most of these types of stories where the kid does something cute, they are funnier when re-told to someone else then when it actually happened. |
This one statement says a lot about you. You should ask yourself why you think that. |
Um, because most people I know, good kid or bad kid, dont really talk to their parents, talk bad about them behind their back, expect too much of them or get mad at them for not getting them this or that, dont really know much about their past or what they're into, dont spend a lot of time with them, dont put thought into gifts or anything of that nature. Sometimes I'm like that too, everyone is. But I think more and more most people are completely ignorant and unappreciative of their parents, and it makes me incredibly mad. it really makes being a parent seem like a waste of time to me. So much sacrifice and time and money and little kids want a provider, and teenagers want the car, and adults move away and dont call, and if the parents get old and need to move in with kids they're seen as a burden. Its all too common. I'm sure theres exceptions and I'm sure at one time the family unit really meant something and people had time where the family sat and talked with one another. I'm sure in some places in the world it still is that way, but I think its lost here, and it aint coming back. Somehow over time kids depended less and less on their parents for any values or teaching or social conversation, and parents just became a provider. And at the same time I think a lot of parents became selfish, and needed more and more to mould their kids into their own idea of what they should be, and became so disconnected from what they're into that even if they ask what their newfangled rap cd is like the kid is going to brush it off because they dont want to talk about what it is or what it means. Over the last couple years I've learned to talk to my parents about politics and a little bit about religion and social issues. I am quite a bit of a mama's boy, but I see within my own extended family and other's families that parents generally dont give a fuck unless the kid is veering too far off their path. I really, honestly dont think most kids take any interest in what their parents are about, and most parents dont take any interest in what their kids are about. its a two way street. I could go on and on about who I blame, but its only going to make me more bitter and angry thinking about just how uncaring families can be. A lot of doom and gloom. It does affect my own politics, because I think if people were paid better with better hours and had proper benefits and were less afraid families would have more time and opportunity to get to know each other instead of being virtual strangers. My general distaste with religious right wingers comes with how they can ignore these other factors and just try and push a Bible to keep the family together, or try and ban/censor certain things and that'll keep Johnny and Susie a part of the family unit and in church every Sunday. And so, you could, but I certainly cant, blame parents for having to work two jobs or working all night shift work and not having time for their kids that they'd like to. But that doesnt excuse the kids for not trying to find the time to know where they came from. Within my own family, sure sometimes mom will ignore me when I'm home to watch her design shows or Survivor or some crap, and sure she still buys me clothes to tries and change the way i dress, but she'll listen to what I have to say, never judge, and support whatever I do. so noone can tell me that family doesn't mean anything to me, because it does. But frankly, young kids really do bore and disgust me, and the grown ones, well, I dont like how the vast majority of them treat their families. The good teenagers arent the ones you see in malls usually. they're home crying... heh. I'm being dark. bleh. I lost track because I'm about to go get Swiss Chalet and all I can think of is chicken sauce... where was I... oh yes. So, in conclusion. Dont like young children in general. However, one of the other main reasons I would not want to have a child is because if I'm working X amount of hours all the time, and partner is working X amount of hours, and all the other time is sleeping and not much money is coming into the household so you have to work more, etc... Dont have a kid. Everyone talks about how they wont have a kid unless they can afford it and buy it what it needs/wants, but they rarely talk about having time to afford it. I barely have time for the friends I have now, and barely enough time in continuing to build by illustration career whilst having a dayjob to get by... and who knows how long that would last? i wouldnt give up on all the friends and the family and projects that I do have so a kid can have a life where his parents are barely around to raise him/her and pass down all the information/trades they've learned. I would never have a kid unless I could give it all that, and for now (and maybe not ever) I dont want to. Plus of course theres the 'what ifs' of a kid being mentally handicapped, or much worse: just an asshole. What a risk. Come on moms and dads, even you know that you'd be crushed if your kid turned out handicapped or in jail. Every parent I've ever known with a handicapped or criminal kid has already had or is teetering on the edge of a nervous breakdown. So then, as I've made this really long and I guess then expect something long back, what I have to ask of the mums and daddies here is how much do your kids know about you and your parents, are you going to keep it that way, are you going to pass it down to them, or are you going to do your work, then come home and nap, hit the computer and let them watch TV? are you going to try and shape them into a certain belief, activity or are you going to do nothing and let them decide, or show them lots of things and see what they're interested in and support that. |
I'm really tired right now, and when I'm tired in front of a keyboard... its lightning speed stream of consciousness blahblahblah |
Seriously. You really think most children are "completely ignorant and unappreciative of their parents" and that the family is lost and not coming back? Certainly there are selfish children, and selfish parents, but you think that's the norm, and that most children don't care about their parents? And, for all your derision of bible thumpers, you sound an awful lot like one here. "Children don't get their values from their parents!" "The family is dead!" "Kids these days are so selfish!" And you talk about risk, but the risks you talk about are the same as those you encounter in all of life, not just the creation of new life. You could be a crime victim or become handicapped tomorrow. Does that mean you don't walk out of your door? You seem to have a very bleak, black and white outlook, focusing mainly on the negative possibilities, discounting the positive ones. Sounds an awful lot like depression to me, my friend. |
NewsMax.com Wires Monday, Jan. 12, 2004 DENVER — Vice President Dick Cheney, who has said states should handle the issue of gay marriage, now says he would support President Bush if he proposes a constitutional amendment banning same-sex marriage. Cheney, whose daughter is a lesbian, told The Denver Post and the Rocky Mountain News in interviews published Saturday that he still believes states should handle the issue, but that he would support Bush's decision. "What I said in 2000 was that the question of whether or not some sort of status, legal status or sanction, ought to be granted in the case of a relationship between two individuals of the same sex was historically a matter the states had decided and resolved and that is the way I preferred it," Cheney told the Post. In the interview with the News, Cheney said that is still his opinion. Bush has said he respects homosexuals' rights but draws the line at gay weddings. He asked government lawyers to research ways to legally define marriage as a union between a man and a woman after courts in Massachusetts and other states recognized the right of gays to the civil benefits of marriage. "At this stage, obviously, the president is going to have to make a decision in terms of what administration policy is on this particular provision, and I will support whatever decision he makes," Cheney told the Post. Although there already is a federal law — the Defense of Marriage Act — that defines marriage as between a man and a woman, some argue that gay marriage should be banned to prevent states from acting independently. Cheney's daughter, Mary, did not comment on the interview. A well-known figure in the Colorado gay community, Mary Cheney has worked for the Colorado Rockies baseball team and the Coors Brewing Co. where, among other duties, she worked on outreach to gays and lesbians. She also worked as a personal aide to her father in the 2000 presidential campaign, and joined the Bush-Cheney '04 campaign last July as the Director of Vice Presidential Operations. © 2003 Associated Press. All Rights Reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed. Editor's note: |
This stuff used to bother me when i actually WAS a kid and I saw how others kids were. I still believe it today but it doesnt depress me because I'm used to it. I just go on and do my own thing and am very happy, as a matter of fact, that wisper feels the same way, and that I dont have to bend over backwards for someone who is going to try and push for a family. That I wont have to sacrifice my time for something I dont want to do and that I'll have my own free time to do my own projects and spend time with wisper. Its great! If some adopted kid or uncle situation ever happened well we'll touch on that when it comes. There are a few people I know who grew up not having any kids and their lives turned out terribly. But there are other couples wispy and I know that grew up without kids and had similar believes as us and similar careers and they are probably the nicest, happiest, well-grounded people we know. "You think that's the norm, and that most children don't care about their parents? " Well obviously they care about them, but not on any wonderful level. They dont know them. "And, for all your derision of bible thumpers, you sound an awful lot like one here." Thats because I think they're mostly right in that regard. Its just that bible thumpers blame the wrong things for this, blame stuff like Grand theft Auto and homosexuals, and they only have one solution: The Bible. "You could be a crime victim or become handicapped tomorrow. Does that mean you don't walk out of your door?" Yes, but theres risks you want to take and/or need to take, and theres ones you dont. Having children isnt the same as leaving the house to go to work. To me its like, er, sky diving. Most people turn out OK, but there IS a risk, and if you dont want to do it anyway, why risk it?. "You seem to have a very bleak, black and white outlook, focusing mainly on the negative possibilities, discounting the positive ones. " And the positive things about having a child that given the career I'm going to take, the things I want to do in life are? Like I said, theres nothing that I like about children enough to put up with them on a daily basis for 20 years or more. "Sounds an awful lot like depression to me, my friend. " Well it ain't, and maybe you'd have to know me to believe me. Why is it so hard to believe that people can feel this way about kids and still be happy? |
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See, that kind of statement is a projection of your own thoughts into the minds of others. There is no way you can know the mind of another, let alone the minds of many. I call spunky on this all of the time. "Why is it so hard to believe that people can feel this way about kids and still be happy?" It's not the fact that you feel this way about kids, its your justification. I know a childless couple who are perfectly happy, afaik. They never wanted children, and I can see why their choice was wise. But I wasn't specifically saying that your views on children are why I suspect depression. It's those black and white, primarily negative, generalized statements about the world. That combined with the fact that that was the longest post I've ever seen you make shows me that you may have some soul searching to do on this particular issue. I'm not saying you should change your mind. I'm saying you should look into it. Discover why you have your views, not in terms of the external world, but in terms of yourself. What about you makes you think you know the mind of a child, and why does that "knowing" result in a belief that a child does not care about their parents? |
"What about you makes you think you know the mind of a child" Well, other than the fact that I was one and still in some ways live like one... :P and like I just said above, the not caring about parents thing has to do with what I think of teenagers, who can actually express not caring about parents, or actually verbally and with their actions express that they dont care and dont know their parents. Eventually do they grow out of the rebellion and start caring again? yes, most do. But does that make them go out and know their parents better? Not necessarily, no way. By that time they're in and out of college and getting married and having their own family... thats the way I see it anyway. Knowing the mind of another? Well if they say they dont care and act like they dont care, I dont think that requires a lot of ESP on my part. Lets me attempt to break this down young kids - I dont like them generally for reasons I've already explained. But they care about their parents, at least because thats nature and such. Some things about that I think are probably natural selfishness, but whatever. teenagers - I like them more because I can talk with them or relate with them. But I dont think most of them care about/know their parents, because of general rebellion and because of selfishness in nature. Therefore, in general, by having kids I'd neither enjoy their childhood nor their teenage years. They wouldnt be much fun for me till they became adults, and with that being the case, might as just make friends with other adults! :P |
is this even about kids anymore? --------- This reminds me, getting to know your parents better can be creepy as heck. Over christmas mom found 2 huge boxes of old photos they'd forgotten about since they bought their current house. All stuff from when they were first dating and married. They were very much into photography and had their own darkroom and etc. Most of it was cool, (Toronto in the 60's!) then at the bottom i found 5 or 6 contact sheets my dad had made... All ass. Nothing but ass. Roll after roll of random girl's butts in hippie jeans. My dad went out for a week straight and just took shots of girls asses as they walked past him. He said "oh yeah, that must have been during my butt period". |
And you call parents selfish? Look, I'm not criticizing your desire to not have children, it just seems that your rationalizations, especially your criticism of "breeders," are rather obtuse. You've set up this artifice of rationalization, most of which is not well founded, contradictory, and based on admitted bias. Why? |
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The "I have a certain life I want to lead, and kids don't fit into it" line is good. The "kids are selfish" line is fatuous. Giving this as a reason for not wanting to be a parent is silly. Of course kids are selfish. Heck, at one point of development they don't even know that something exists if they can't see it! The "breeders are selfish" concept and related stuff is pretty irrational. Basically, don't place the blame on others for your own choices. |
Or something. While no families are perfect, I think the vast majority of parents do not regret having children. |
understand what exactly? what is there I'm supposed to understand here? I dont get where bias really fits in here. Nothings based on some pre-set bias, "bias" is the end result. I gave you my 'results' from my life experience, and I dont see whats contradictory Tiggy. I dont see any 'artifice of rationalization' when it comes to what I think about kids. As for the "Breeders". You're more on target, but only when we're talking about people I know who have or are going to have kids. Yeah theres a bias, and its mean.. Is that unfair? yes. But its as simple as our friends are going to end up having kids, and they will spend more time with their family and not me. I dont like that. yes, thats selfish and I can admit that. But its the truth. I'm sure you've had a friend who went and got a girlfriend/boyfriend and then basically disappeared. You hope they're happy in their relationship but you cant help but be a little upset that you dont see them as much anymore, and maybe sometimes you actually dislike the person they're with, as if its their fault. So switch that situation with a parent and their kids. I might dislike or have a bias against the kid they have and not be interested in the kid, when really the one I'm upset with is the parent who doesnt hang out with me as much. yeah its selfish, but its the truth. Its a completely different situation from the general dislike of kids that I have. So if you're looking at statements about one and mixing it with the other, maybe thats were you see contradictions or selfishness or jealousy come through. My conclusion: dislike of kids in general comes from experience and I think my reasons are well-founded. dislike of parent friends and their kids comes from selfishness, even if the parents should probably make the effort to keep in touch. In that case, I may selfishly dislike the kid, but I might also dislike the kid for the same reasons I dislike kids in general. And now I'm basically done with this. I dont want to see the word "kid" for a good long while. Too much in too short a time. In writing of this I've had to think of kids too much, I'm going to have nightmares,I'm going to have the word "kis" resonating through my head. Arrgh I think I'm gonna barf. I've even had Kid Rock songs go into my head. If you have any more questions or anything save them for another time or post em and I'll come back to them in a few weeks or something. |
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but hey, don't have kids. whatever. follow your own balloon. |
Understand the reasons a child may be selfish. Disliking a child because they're selfish is akin to disliking a starving person because they're hungry. |
without the psych evaluation? "The "breeders are selfish" concept and related stuff is pretty irrational." Many people spawn for self-serving reasons. It is a practice rife with selfishness. selfish. shellfish. shelf-ish. Sell fish. Phish. |
And then what? Open a daycare? Understanding why they're selfish (which is obvious, they have to be to survive) isn't going to make them less annoying. I understand why birds have to shit on my car. I still don't like it. "Disliking a child because they're selfish is akin to disliking a starving person because they're hungry." guh? That's not a good comparison. Starving people can be fed. And they don't wander the aisles at WalMart screaming and throwing goo-covered lollipops at you. although it would be interesting if they did. |
Actually, I do have a problem with people stating that they "don't like kids." If someone were to say that they don't like black people, they would be racist. If they stated that they didn't like women, they would be sexist. How is saying that you don't like children any different than those examples? Do you guys not see how outrageous and bizarre it is to generalize that you don't like a gigantic section of our overall population? I probably shouldn't say anything, being that I am no good at debate. But still, damn. Basically, Antigone said it better as usual. ps- I like you guys anyhow. |
cloudy definitions of "kid" or "kids" are perhaps, in part, at play here. also, "i dislike children" and "i do not plan to have children" are not the same statement. and a desire to not reproduce is not a radical concept. carry on. |
Well for one, you cant pass a kid over for promotion at the office because they're a kid. This is ridiculous enough to get me to break my promise and post again on this thread. If you really believe this, you better start letting kids into strip clubs and eliminating the drinking age. And dont say thats for kids own protection, because theres more than a few reasons noone wants to see a kid in a bar. Absolutely everyone is ageist against kids, even you. Yer making a hideous stretch to try and make a point. |
EXPLICIT CONTENT About alcohol, about pornography (whatever that is). What business is it of yours what I do, buy, read, see or take into my body as long as I do not harm another human being on this planet. And for all those people out there who are having a little moral dilemma in your head about how to answer that question I'll answer it for you: none of you fuckin' business! Take that to the bank, cash it, and take a vacation out of my life. But see, here's their argument to that each and every time: "but we have to protect the children, we have to protect the children." Listen children are smarter than any of us. You know how I know that? I don't know one child with a full time job and children. They're quick these kids. Fuckin' quick. But where did this veneration of childbirth come from? I missed that meeting. Childbirth is wonderful, childbirth is a miracle. Wrong. It's no more a miracle than eating food and a turd coming out your ass. You know what a miracle is? A miracle is raising a kid that doesn't talk at a movie theater. If it were a miracle then not every nine months any yin yang in the world could drop a litter of these mewling cabbages on the planet. And in case you have not checked the single mom statistics lately the miracle is spreading like wildfire. Hallelujah. Trailer parks all over America filling up with little miracles. Thunk, thunk, thunk. Look at all my little miracles. Filling up my trailer like a sardine can. Look at them. You know what would be a little miracle? If I could remember your daddy's name. I guess I'll have to call you Trucker Jr. That's all I remember about your daddy was his fuzzy little pot belly riding on top of me shooting his caffeine ridden semen into my belly to produce my little water head miracle baby child. Thunk. There's your brother, Pizza Delivery Boy Jr. Thunk. Here's your other brother, Will Work For Food Jr. Thank you, goodnight. |
The point that I am attempting to make, and again I freely admit to being the worst at debate, is that no two children are the same. It's the generalizations that I take issue with. The drinking age has nothing whatsoever to do with what I'm trying to say. Bah. Fahgeddaboudit. |
how bout twins, or 2 out of 5 quints? /rimshot "The drinking age has nothing whatsoever to do with what I'm trying to say." well you call a line of thinking ageist and I call it back on the rest of the world. Kids aren't equal. its not the same. |
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completly. it just seems...well....souless to just write off someone because of their age. and you know, i've never thought you guys souless in this regard. i remember crimson used to go on this silly rant about breeders and I found it annoying then. its like, god damn, for someone so rich in everything else in life, everything she and pilate were doing for their adopted kid, to turn around and go on a anti-breeder rant just, was stupid. Im not going to take the highly-skilled logical debate route that antigone has taken. leave that to him. frankly rowlfy, your posts have exhausted me due to sheer length. But like agatha, froma a mere emotional, surface level, the kind of statements, just seem so damn souless. |
But it doesn't require a psychological analysis, and that's not what I'm giving. Besides, in my opinion you can only give that to yourself. I'm just trying to persuade you to do it... |
ugh. too soon! i should get to the haven fun faster |
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Selfish children can be fed, too. It's called "parenting." It takes a bit longer to get a result, so I hear it teaches you patience. :) |
Wow, that was too Oprah for words. Great jorb. Its ironic how you think the way I feel is soulless. And I think having kids is soul-sucking. Let me think my way, and you can have yours. My dislike of kids is not self-hate, and you're just going to have to trust me on that. Diff'rent strokes "To me not liking children is similar to not liking yourself" For you maybe. And for those of us who like who we are now and liked who we were as a child? |
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hahaaa... they are beautiful, kids ! kids ! kids! |
Yes, because its not the same. To me by the time these kids are properly "fed", they're late teens/young adults. |
Yay, snow! "i remember crimson used to go on this silly rant about breeders and I found it annoying then. its like, god damn, for someone so rich in everything else in life, everything she and pilate were doing for their adopted kid, to turn around and go on a anti-breeder rant just, was stupid. " uhm, if you're talking about Oswald, he was being adopted by Pilate and his boyfriend (now husband) Trace. Crimson and her husband Pug were just their friends. At least that's how memory serves me. oh, the two Traces. Both gay in their own respects. hah! i kill me! |
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well i never hey babies!! |
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She's also that way about cats and house plants. |
they were menacing i tell ya, but the reality is, i know they're all pussy cats underneath. the more rough around the edges the more soft the insides. |
but there's just too many damn threads to search, so i don't care. |
But, as you say, there are too many threads and no way to search them easily, so we'll never know. :Þ |
http://www.nytimes.com/library/magazine/home/20000723mag-kids.html verrry long. if you plan to read you might want to print it out and lie down. |
Or anti goes and finds it. scary, that. |
i can't describe it. i find it frustrating. It reeks of obvious spin by the author being a parent of 2. |
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Crimson was married to a man called Ren. I remember this from when I put three years worth of threads into my brain during a bout of insomnia shortly before I started posting. I also thought that if there were any truth to the Oswald Jr. conspiracy theory, then maybe it was Ren, because Oswald's real name is Brendan and you can't spell Brendan without r-e-n. |
We had a lot of fun -- we played with her gerbils and read Shel Silverstein poems and played video games and played house. I had to make her a special type of pasta for lunch because she has food allergies, and -- look how cute she is -- she told me I did a really good job making her lunch and "even the burned parts taste good!" Hee! And she was sincere! She's very affectionate and open-hearted. At least twice she told me she was so glad I was there with her and how much fun I was, and she gave me a big hug before I left, and...and....I was just filled with warm fuzziness from spending the day with her. |