The need for female companionship has reached an impass and Hal is beginning to feel fucking lame again after several months of being pretty goddamned lonely. I realize how Sem feels in a sort of way, except for the fact that my life isn't in quite as much control as his is. I know I'm bitching, I'm doing it on pourpose. I keep seeing things around me, I saw it when I went home, and have seen it upon returning to Missoula from the Christmas vacation. Hell I have even seen it here before Christmas ever came. Things like the events going on with Sarah and Kevin. I'm speaking mearly of the lack of appreciation some people have for their sig. other. What do I mean by this? With every girl I've ever dated, I fall into this way of attempting to treat said person like a princess, I'm too much of a "nice guy" for my own good. The problem with being a nice guy is not that females pass you up for guys who are assholes, but the fact you have to see them with the assholes, and watch said assholes treat them like shit when you would like nothing more then to treat them like a princess. No I'm not calling Kevin and asshole... well ok... I am. (And no I'm not saying I would be any better, fuck I live in Montana, I would have nothing to offer someone like Sarah, but then again thats the point. Neither does Kevin.) I use them as an example, for I see such things happen everyday. And not only do I feel this need to treat someone right, to make someone smile, to cuddle and be close to someone. BUT GODDAMNIT I'M A 19 YEAR OLD MALE, I have hormone levels that are breaking the gauge. The need to have sex with someone other then myself is becoming an extradition into the preisthood already. Enough of my bitching, you all can now post what you like... Fuck fuck fuck fuck fuck. (just felt the need to say fuck a few times.)

i keep hearing men bitching about women who feel some deranged need to date assholes in lieu of dating nice guys. if i had a nickel for every guy who's whined about this to me, i'd be donald goddamn trump. as for me personally, i'll take nothing BUT a nice guy. in fact, a man who treats me w/ anything less than utter respect will find himself thrown out in the morning w/ the rest of the trash. i don't deal in macho nonsense & i have no moral problem whatsoever about squashing such men like roaches. but i do see what you're saying, to some limited degree. i've seen the type of women you're talking about. i have a relative who treats women like crap & he's never got a shortage of fucking morons to date. but they're SO patently stupid that even he gets tired quickly of their dumb little-girl tricks & low self-esteem. they're nobodies. just holes to be fucked...& like any good knothole, you forget about them thirty seconds afterward. i'm surrounded by some wonderful men in my life who have very similar complaints to yours. they're sweet, gentle, kind, & chronically single. i wish i could date them all, but i've already married one of them. i don't know why women don't go for them. i find their courteousness & gentle demeanor VERY appealing. nothing tempts & attracts me like a genuinely kind-hearted man (& i don't mean the type of scumbag who's exhibiting bogus manners just to get in a woman's pants, either). i've often dated men who aren't good-looking & are poor as rats...but they were NICE. and that means everything. the only thing sexier than kindness is intellect. no need to date an idiot, after all (there are too many of them around these days, & they're disposable as bic lighters...burn through them & toss 'em in the dumpster). but remember, nice isn't everything. it's a huge, HUGE part of the equation...but some of the guys i've heard whining the loudest about women disliking nice guys are actually packing other problems-bigass problems-that are keeping the women away. they may indeed be gentlemanly as a knight in shining armor, but it can't cancel out their lousy hygiene and halitosis. it doesn't nullify their atrocious personal habits. in other words, being nice is a great thing, but it can't transform a gibbering, clueless geek into a hollywood star overnight. it can't turn a klutz into a king. there are usually other factors at work when a nice guy keeps getting turned down. it's not always society's fault, as they so often like to pretend. anyway, i'm genuinely sorry to hear that you're hurting. and pardon the extended rantage here, but i just had to scream it from the rooftops that not ALL women are attracted to jerks & bullies. that's a stereotype that makes me ill.

GODDAMNED COMPUTERS!!! I just typed out about a 3 page response on that and as soon as I hit the Preview/Post button the damn thing up and died on me... God why did I choose this profession, it sure as hell isn't a glorious one. Anyway, what I tried to say, (and granted this is the abridged version) is that I shower 2 times a day and brush my teeth 3 times. I also have some sense of how to dress, whether it be for an occasion or just casual. I don't know ask Moonit, or Spider, they may possibly be able to answer whether or not I'm just some hidious fucking troll or something such as that. I don't know... I don't want to date the stupid, I want to date someone fairly attractive (to me anyway.) and someone who is intelligent. Them liking me would be a plus... Although I also seem to find that I lack the skills in the female department, guess I'm not one of those guys who "sweeps them of their feet" as it would be said. I consider myself in the margin of intelligence, I'm fairly articulate, my spelling skills could use some work I know. But I know how to speak, and provide interesting conversation when necissary. I'm about damn ready to say "I don't need a new VCR and go out and spend 60 bucks at the bar tonight, not just on myself mind you but whomever happens to be around and is interested in showing some attention for a night of free drinking, no obligations, just be cute, show a little interest, act somewhat intelligent, get your free drink and leave, thats all it will take... So anyone up for some free drinks?

hell, i'd take that free drink myself, but it's too far a drive. hope i wasn't being too weird about the whole topic...it's just been getting to me lately, listening to one guy after another getting all maudlin because "women don't like nice guys". i LIVE for nice guys & i just wanted to say so.

And we thank you for that Crimson. Now all we ask is you convince others who are not as wise as yourself. You found a nice guy and you married him, and your happy, no? I'm sure they are out there somewhere... The sad thing, is I'm getting to the point in seeking female companionship that I'm almost ready to drop standards and take the first female with breasts and a low cut skirt and do what I can.... However I have not reached that level yet, and will if possible avoid it at all costs. Yeah sure would be good for a night on the town and elsewhere, but I'm not just interested in sex right now (even though I am 19, I have more on my mind then sex every 10 seconds) I want a little bit of conversation, and cuddling, and possibly some interest in the things I do, or to share interest in the things said person does. Not bitching any more, seeking advice finding such a person.

you probably won't find such a person hanging around in bars. if you come home w/ some kind of barfly, she's likely not going to be a nobel prize contender. a college campus is better for cruising (but even that's not 100% foolproof, as we've all met plenty of college-educated idiots). i've gotten dates from hanging around in libraries. goth or underground chicks can be fun & are often brighter than average. if you have a hobby of any sort or are a devotee of organized religion, there are often groups of like-minded people that can turn into dating pools. for me, music was a big thing...my chances of meeting people and/or getting laid always increased dramatically when involved in a band. i still run personal ads online & have met tons of cool people that way...some i'd probably date, if given the chance. shit, i married someone i met in a personal ad, so i do recommend it, if you haven't already given it a try. those are just a few ideas. i don't know if any of this will seem helpful, but it's just a few thoughts off the top of my head.

Prehaps though Hal, girls sense that your heart belongs to another. You need to let that girl go, otherwise you'll never find anyone else.

Thx... Yeah, the thing is I live in a college town, so barflies all happen to be college girls. Goths are fun, however the lack of apparent goths in missoula is sad. I miss the diversity and conversation they provide. Personal adds I have not tried really, I could give that a shot but I won't hold my breath. The numeric chance of sucess with personal adds is a BIG margin... You are one of the few the lucky and the proud, I may be to, but I won't leave that my only option. (also it seems that the cool people I meet online always happen to be a few hundred miles away.)

Guess what my friend Tash is helping me to do. Go on, guess. Give up? She's making me do stuff alone. ALONE. I need to be alone. I've spent the last six odd years in two relationships so I'm taking some time out. Anyway, we made a list of stuff I can do by myself, that I've never done by myself. And one of them is to go to the movies alone. Isn't that wierd. I've never been to the movies alone. And there's heaps I want to see, and no one to see them with so I don't go. Well, not anymore buddies. I'm scared.

Its not as scary as you think... Just stay away from the creepy guy in the corner. And Moonit, that is on my mind as well, but in a special reserved place only for thinking about once in a while. If I were to partake a relationship, I will let go, I don't belive in baggage start anew as they say. If I find a girl interested in me, my baggage is my own, and will be shared with only my personal blog (one that doesn't exist in the world its mearly a bunch of word files that I have passworded and I write to once in a while, thats all.) Other then that, she is a side factor in my life, one that remains so, you never forget the ones you love, and I don't plan to but I also don't plan on trying to follow that path for the rest of my life.

i have nothing helpful to say, but i will drink to you, hal, when i finally crack open my yuletide bottle of scotch.

Enjoy.

Hal, Take the ugliest girl you know out to dinner. Treat her like a queen. Not like a romantic interest. More a very good friend. Then get the number of the waitress that serves you. I found this out when I got married. For some reason the girls who wouldn't give me the time of day earlier, all of a sudden noticed I was alive. This is true. Women are just as preditory as men. They just hide it better. They are also just as vain. They will all drool over the good looking jerk. And, totally miss the average looking nice guy. Sorry, that's life.

Of course sometimes even the good looking guys who happen to be nice sometimes lose out. My best friend is one of those guys, the kind you'ld like to kill, who has all the girls drooling for him. He doesn't seem to notice. He's a real nice guy. Must be to stay friends with me for over twenty years. He just loses the girls because he moves so slow. As soon as he decides he really likes a girl and wants to get serious - she's gone. I guess most girls find nice guys to boring.

it's simply the sense that they're gonna be smothered by a desperate, clingy dude with low self-esteem that keeps women away from chronically single dudes. it's that look in the eyes and the frequency they resonate at (somewhere around 18000 khz, i believe. the ideal would be ½ that or less) that women can sense, consciously or otherwise. relax. except for being wanted, they're scarcely any different than you are.

My best friend is single and her love life is a nightmare. I have hooked her up with a couple of nice guys, but well she's insane. First one stood her up on the first date. OK I understand that. 2nd guy "moved too fast" and talked to her like they were in a relationship. Shame on him :) Then she fell for this hot looking mailman who treated her like shit. To get her over it I took her out dancing to my favorite nite club. We met a guy there who was good looking and nice and a lot of fun. One of those rare ones who understood I was married and respected that and tried to make sure the other guys there respected my boundaries whether they liked it or not. He was genuine and had a good sense of humor. We had an absolute blast. Tomorrow night we have a double date. She is already looking for ways to tell him off. It is almost like she is looking for some freakish quality in him that will tell her to run away. I don't understand it, but then again I have been off of the market for years. Maybe I am the weird one. I don't see single men all that different from single women. I know men who use women for sex and women who use men for sex. I know women who are extremely beautiful in who they are, but because they aren't on the cover of Cosmo they don't get asked out on dates. I know men who are wonderful intelligent and successful who only attract the attention of strippers who are after their money. My cousin Mandi is a wonderful person. Her boyfriend of 5 years is a wiccan and she has adopted his beliefs. She supports him. He doesn't even go to school anymore. All he does for her is tell her how fat and ugly she is and how boring she is. In the last five years the person she once was has disappeared and she now has so little self esteem that she has let herself go over 300 lbs. in a rebellion against her boyfriend. She doesn't know how to pay her rent anymore. She has let herself become a lost little kitten. The only thing I have in common with her is that we both like "The Rocky Horror Picture Show" and we both are into theater. I guess that my point is that both men and women can be predators or the abused, and I am glad that I don't have to worry about this anymore, but I must honestly say that single life sux and doesn't make sense. Love ya but glad I am not you!!!!

No shit... And I don't vibrate at any frequency, I don't go to bars or anywhere looking. I find its pointless to look, if you do it just ends up being more frustrating. Probably going to go to the bar on New Years Eve, its payday, and I have nothing better to do. (Thats assuming my team gets their ass kicked by the # 7 team on the ladder in the first round, if they don't I'll be at home for a match.) But if they get their ass kicked I'm going to get good and intoxicated, and play pool all night long... In tight jeans... And I may not be a tall handsome man, actually I'm kinda short and stocky but I have a little tiny ass god damnit and I'm going to use it!!!

You go!!!!!

Jeans are a sin. I only own one pair, and I swear to god.... I VIL BURN DEM YA'....

tight pants are good. 'drew was short (well my height) and stockyish, and he had a nice leg/ass thing going on.

I have football thighs... When I was a freshman in highschool I played football, the only thing I was good at was being a lineman because I was short. But they said I needed some more lower body strenght so they made me do squats, and leg presses, and workout on the hip sled. Soooo, I can still squat about 500 lbs, but my thighs are football thighs because not only did I get them from foot ball but they are about that size, (Still hard as rock though, the only thing I'm still proud of.) As for my ass, I have a little ass, but because of all the squats, and leg presses I did, my ass ended up being the same as my thighs, muscular... As for the rest of me, I'm a broad shoulderd short person (5'7" or 170.18 centimeters for you other non american folks.) And I weigh in at about 185 lbs, (or 83.9160 Kg, for you non american folks.) So I'm not fat or anything, just broad shouldered with thick legs and a musclular butt.

Ya,but can you open a can of spinach with your butt muscles?

Nothing like a good can opener. Since I'm old and troll-like, I have nothing to say here. I spent over a decade trolling college campuses and at the time was happily married and at the time saw some pretty horrible match ups between the most unlikely of god's two legged creatures. Idiots with idiot-savants. Piano players with ceramics majors. Some guy right out of The Lord of Flies with some chick who'd give Loo-Lee-Ta a run for her britches. And as a boringly monogamous but relatively happy as a macaroni noodle in warm cuddly white sauce... after seventeen years of marriage, I thought my divorce which btw was 'way back when Hal was eight (8)!!! was such an ending...well, there's being alone, being lonely, being the lone ranger with antlers, and being a sorabjite stuck in Montana. As long as we're lookin' there's seldom anything worth lookin' at...go about being the best you can be and there's gonna be a line a-awaiting... Lemme tell ya, Hal, life is too short to go moping around complaining about how other sex-crazed impolite narrow minded limited intelligence shallow lived individuals ... take advantage of the opposite sex or small barnyard animals... Crimson's got some good feedback, yep. And you can always count on Cz to find the humor in serious tomes. It does help that you shower. Try the advice I received years ago as a stodgy little neophyte college professor who was stuck on the seriousness of life and love: put a couple of q-tips in your ear after soaking them in some flammable liquid, light them both, get naked and ride into town on your skateboard. THEN they'll notice ya..

I've got the opposite problem. Somebody's hitting on me and I wish he'd fucking disappear. Some local guy has decided that I'm pretty hot. That's nice, real nice. Normally, it wouldn't be a problem. Normally, I would be flattered. But this guy's getting overbearing. Closet case, wife and kids, the whole bag. And he kissed me. He fucking kissed me. On the job. I wanted to rip his head off. He grabbed me in a corridor when we were alone. Suddenly came charging up at me and got me in something just short of a headlock. I didn't initiate it. I didn't do anything. This guy is way smaller than me and I don't know what possessed him to grab me like that but I could've killed him. In retrospect, I don't even know what stopped me from decking him. I didn't tell my spouse. I just couldn't. However, for some weird reason, I told my kid. My son's been confiding heavily in me about private matters, so I thought I'd turn to him for some advice for a change. He was very mature and comforting, and then he told me the obvious: to tell my spouse. Which I finally did. My man was not happy. It wasn't my fault. But he realized that. I was afraid at first that he was pissed off at me. He just seemed pissed off in general, although not badly so. He's not the type to be hot tempered. He's so calm that I've often wondered if anything would ever move him to anger. Well, apparently, somebody messing with me might be the ticket. He was outwardly calm as usual, but that look.......that LOOK in his eyes. Holy shit. I think the dude who kissed me was just acting on impulse. He said he'd never done anything like that before. I had half a thought to sue for sexual harassment, but fuck it, it's not that big a deal. So why weren't guys grabbing me and kissing me when I was single?

For the same reason females aren't doing it to me right now... As for confiding in your child, you'd find it amusing how often that happens. My mom confided in me constantly when I was younger. Her relationshiip with my father has gotten better since I've left the house because the only person there now to confide in was him.

hal. go to nerve.com if you haven't and do a personal ad, with your previous post in it. You can do several apparently, so why not do a couple ones stressing different parts of your whole and see what happens? Also buy and use credits. I can't stress that enough. Pilate, your situation sucks. I don't know how you workplace is, but that is definately something to bring up to a supervisor. Unless your supervisor is someone that this sort of information is not something he can handle well. I 'm glad my workplace isn't like that, we have our sexual harassment policy clearly out in the open.

I have two different jobs. One of them is so cool and laid back that it's ridiculous. The other job sucks ass. Of course, it's the suckass job where this happened. I'll just play it by ear. I'm kind of getting the feeling that this guy has gotten his kicks, and that it's over. He did what he wanted to do. In fact, had I reciprocated in any way, it probably would've scared him to death. That's the kind of repression case I'm dealing with here. Anyway, I'll just see what happens. If the guy can contain himself then I'll be cool about it and let it slide.

Already did Sem, and I'm waiting for reply on a couple of them... I suppose I should create another profile or two... I've only got one right now... the_devils_avocado.

I think the guy is going through a ruff time in his life, and went off his nut for a little. Ignore it. Hopefully he's so embarrased any mention of it would send him screaming down the hall. Reminds me of the cartoon Dexter's Labratory. The episode where he over worked his brain. And, he was running around in his underware. Then finally kissed a duck's bottom.

Never quite done that before... Never been that desperate to kiss someone out of the blue who I had no intuation about or any clue or anything. I think I fear getting my ass kicked more then anything, but thats just because I fall for chicks that are taller then me. And not the tall skinny ones either, I tend to end up falling for the tall amazonian "I can throw your body as far as I can throw this spear" type of women... Thus kissing them out of the blue and catching them off guard would usually mean me pulling my head from my ass later and my shoes from my ears.

I had a guy do that to me at work once. I was single, and he was dating someone. I liked him, though, so I never did anything about it. At least I got a free bottle of my favorite wine out of it :) Like 4 months later a friend of mine called me saying he wanted to start dating me. Haa haa. Later he called and left me a message "This is Bob. Call me later." I never called him.

I was ambushed and suddenly smackerooed on the lips by the department head in the box office when I was an undergraduate. I politely but firmly wriggled away before he could do something really offensive like offer me a part. I told a couple of people, and the next thing I know, a delegation of faculty wanted to talk to me... "We heard what happened to you, and... we just want you to know, if you want to take action, we'll support you 100%..." I politely declined. He had a reputation and it was time the old has-been alcoholic was outta there but it wasn't going to be my doing, not over one kiss.

What crimson said, exactly. Hal, when you see a nice sweet girl going with a total jackass, do you ever question the girls brain functions? No. You'd just rather sum it up that girls dig assholes. This is not the case. Girls who dig assholes are idiots. Not worth your time and affection. Don't cry for them honey, they're already dead. Nice smart girls like nice smart guys. If you find your dreamgirl hanging off Mr.MissingLink, chances are she ain't quite the princess you're after. If these girls can't respect themselves enough to find a decent guy, they aren't worth yours either. Keep it in your pants and you will find this person. Don't search and don't stalk. Just sit there, being your wonderful self, and the princess will find you. Don't flirt and don't seek out relationships. Just attempt to make friends, and nothing more. That's the best way. live, damn you, LIVE!

jesus. does anyone consider the time spent relating online (i.e. chats,boards, newsgroups etc) severely retards our ability to deal with people realtime, reallife? What did people do before personals? chats? message boards?

i come to the message boards to escape from my overly demanding social life. you may think i'm kidding, but i'm not.

It is peaceful and relaxing, sometimes. Aiigh! cold coffee!! pheeeuuuww!

Like Gossamer said in a Looney Tunes cartoon "People! Aigh!!!!"

They ate their young.

And had hot oil monkey sex.

Thats always good advice...........not to stalk.

and slept with thier ex-boyfriends

ohhhh moonit moonit moonit moonit.