| THIS IS A READ-ONLY ARCHIVE FROM THE SORABJI.COM MESSAGE BOARDS (1995-2016). |
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Funny what happens to principles when shallow hypocrites are running the show. The feminist and liberal establishment’s abandonment of Iraqi women and children, in the name of partisan politics, is nothing short of obscene. After all, the “anti-war” demonstrations are actually “anti-Bush” rallies. On March 7, International Women’s Day, several women, including the Very-Self-Important-Black-Woman-Author Alice Walker and Not-Very-Important-At-All–Attempted-Actress-and-Malcontent Janeane Garafalo, demonstrated at the White House to, in the words of one organizer, “stop this immoral and unnecessary war from happening…” How disgusting that a day meant to show support for women around the world showcased how selfish and cruel American feminists have become. Of course, NOW was there in all its irrelevance. While acknowledging that Saddam Insane is a “maniacal tyrant, cruel and vicious,” they bravely called for the U.S. to do nothing, allowing that brutal and vicious man to torture and gas more his own citizens, including women and children, to death. Is this suddenly okay because the women being tortured aren’t wearing burqas? The feminist establishment’s political game with women’s lives is particularly disgraceful as they, of all interest groups, have a special duty to support ridding the world of Saddam. Consider a 25-year-old Iraqi woman known as "Um Haydar" who, as Amnesty International reports, was beheaded in front of her children and in the street without charge or trial at the end of December 2000 after her husband was suspected of illegal political activity. Security men took her body and the head away in a plastic bag. The fate of her children and mother-in-law, all of whom were also taken, remains unknown. It’s funny how the fate of women and children—so righteously declared as the special and unique charge of the American leftist feminist movement—means nothing when the president is a Republican. Yes, Um Haydar, you only count to the American Feminist Elite when it suits their politics and makes one of their boys look good. I am reminded every day during this crisis why I resigned my leadership position in NOW back in 1996. I finally saw the feminist establishment for the political sham it was. Obviously, nothing much has changed. For Ms. Walker, Ms. Garafalo, NOW, and every other unconscious and misguided feminist who thinks that removing Saddam is ‘immoral,’ remember Um Haydar is just one of thousands of women who have been raped, tortured and murdered in front of their families. Think of Um’s children, her daughters, whom you have abandoned. Then go to sleep at night and pray to God that the dead can’t really invade your dreams because there are thousands of dead Iraqi women who know how you betray them, in the name of politics, in the name of hating George W. Bush, in the name of your own cynical political hypocrisy. Today’s “liberals,” including their pathetic representatives in Hollywood, don’t really care about people or principles—all their braying has nothing to do with stopping war, or caring about “innocents.” No, it’s about sacrificing innocent women on the Altar of Politics. It’s about slogans and partisanship and political power. Forget about the real struggle, the real women dying, the real rape of children, the real beheadings. The pond scum of Hollywood to leftist special interest groups to communist traitors who give aid and comfort to our enemy with anti-USA and anti-George W. Bush marches prefer to let Saddam Insane’s innocent victims struggle and die so they can make political points here at home. Because they want Republicans to look bad. Just a few weeks ago Susan Sarandon, one of our more empty vessels, exposed her self-obsessed narcissistic agenda by complaining that we shouldn’t go after Saddam Insane by saying “what has he ever done to us?” Thank God Sarandon and her ilk had nothing to do with foreign policy in the first half of the last century. After all, none of those millions of Jews and gays and gypsies Hitler was murdering were “us” either. As a classical liberal I know that true liberalism is indeed about helping people less fortunate than ourselves. It’s about ridding the world of tyrants so people can live in freedom. It’s about expanding democracy so people can control their own lives. It’s about risking our lives so people other than “us,” like Iraqis, Kurds and Afghanis, can not only live through the day, but have hope at the end of it. In Iraq, women and children are slaughtered to punish Saddam’s enemies. New gas techniques are tried out on prisoners and animals. Homosexuals are murdered by the state simply for being gay. This is a war the feminist and gay elite, human rights advocates and even the animal rights movement should be out in front fanatically supporting. Instead, they remain silent or actively oppose ridding the world of a man who has killed more women, children, and gays than the Taliban ever could have dreamed. While I am proud of you readers who identify as conservative, based on the e-mail I get I know plenty of liberals read this column as well. Take note of this if you are liberal and have fallen into a zombie-fied lockstep with your favorite movie star or activist group against the liberation of Iraq: The exact same arguments, the exact same demonstrations, the exact same appeasement won out in the 1930’s when fascism was rising in Europe and Asia. Containment, agreements, and promises made by tyrants manifested into genocide. There was an excuse for appeasers in the 1930’s--they did not know what hell awaited them, or the rest of the civilized world. We do. So continue to wring your hands, pound your desk, and hate the president while you chant “not in my name.” Then go get your double-mocha non-fat latte, send money to NOW or Amnesty International to make yourself feel good, and continue your charade as a “feminist” or “liberal.” In the process, you guarantee your cowardice and betrayal of the suffering will be in your name, while the decent and brave risk and give their lives for women like Um Haydar, her children, and thousands more like them, wherever they may be. Source Yes, it is a Jewish Website, but I thought this article was very interesting. |
this is getting old. you make no case nor any sense. |
Now will the UN's? Then there will never be a case for war, and dictators should all be allowed to continue, and I never want to hear you bitch about death penalties again. Because you want death penalties for all iraqi's. |
It is OK to leave saddam in power over millions because there are lots more like him. It is not OK to put a man who has killed others with intent to do so to death. It is ok to kill babies because the mother simply does not want them. But it is not ok to kill saddam who has litteraly killed millions OVER OIL! Who really does not make sense. |
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I mean, not that patrick's do, either. |
i'm so turned around by trace's careful cutting and pasting! He's finally won me over! I'm so totally changed by what i've read here. This simple text on this one thread on this tiny message board has changed my life forever! I'm for the war now. I really am. Bomb the fucker right to to hell. That's it. I'm pulling a hard right turn as of this moment. Holy crap, you changed my mind. I get it all now, it's so clear. All your arguing and CAPS and repitition has done something, at last. This isn't all in vain. It's not just meaningless drivel for both sides. First me, next... the world!! And to think i was getting tired of it. thank you so much. it was all worth it for THIS MOMENT. I was so wrong, about the war, about abortion, about everything. Oh thank you, THANK YOU! *weeping* |
I dont expect it to change anyone's minds, i am not sure why i keep it up. |
I would imagine that most feminists don't see war a way of stopping the treatment of other women. In fact, war would just make things worse for those already mistreated wouldn't you say? |
The africans whom were treated as slaves are far worse off now. And Americans are far worse off then we were before the revolution. I am sure the Jews are going to agree that things are far worse then they were before we defeated Hitler. Aks the Afgan women would prefer the Taliban be restored to power. Thank you for bringing things into sharp focus. |
Better |
"Not-Very-Important-At-All–Attempted-Actress-and-Malcontent Janeane Garafalo" Priceless! |
The africans whom were treated as slaves are far worse off now. And Americans are far worse off then we were before the revolution. I am sure the Jews are going to agree that things are far worse then they were before we defeated Hitler. Aks the Afgan women would prefer the Taliban be restored to power. Thank you for bringing things into sharp focus." again trace you go for that bottom line. its all about the bottom line. you don't care how its done and what the consequences are so long as you get that bottom line. While they might become "free" (from Saddam, and not from whatever puppet they put in next) Fallout from a war in Iraq will undoubtedly make things worse for everyone... you could free Tibet by taking on China, but I don't think you want to do that, do you? Its called thinking ahead, something Bush's administration has proved it cannot do... THIS is why you are seeing these types of protests now before a war even starts. you act like anti-Americanism spread like a plague over the course of 3 months, like Saddam put something in the water. What you're doing now trace, is grasping at straws, trying to prove to yourself and only yourself that you believe in this bullshit... its as if you know you're wrong now and this is the crazy angst before you let it out, kind of like in TV movies before the 35 year old gay lawyer comes out of the closet... |
I noticed that you didn't feel like asking the Native Americans if they were better off...Interesting how you are very quick to accuse the liberals of being selective in their protests... As far as I know, and I probably know a lot more feminists than you, trace, feminists have never stopped protesting and working for women's equality worldwide. That's been pretty inconvenient for conservatives everywhere, who prefer it that when women want to know what time it is, they look at the clock on the stove. |
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I dont expect it to change anyone's minds, i am not sure why i keep it up." Because there are so many straw men still left to fight. |
Of course, if it were CLinton, that wouldn't work. Unless we had Laura Bush on board....(evil grin) |
imperialist fuckshit. you wanna go on a dictator cleansing tour trace? why stop at iraq. next on the list...Iran, then N.Korea, then China, then Pakistan, Saudi Arabia and so on. Fuck off with your immoral war talk. You're completely illogical and you're philosophically inept and confused trace. |
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SAVE THE FREEDOM GRAVY- WAR NOW! |
"Remember that he doesn't believe that a fetus is a baby." ? a zygoat is a zygoat. an embryo is an embryo a fetus is a fetus an infant is an infant. a woman is a woman ok? its not that i dont believe a 'fetus is not a baby'? not that this has any bearing on anything related to war../ |
But, he says if we attack, he'll unleash chemical and biological weapons on the world. Where's he gettin' them, if he doesn't have any? A quick trip to wal-mart? He needs to be making up his mind. He can't have it both ways. |
If you mean this statement, nowhere does he mention chemical and biological weapons. |
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And something was mentioned about Saddam unleashing his biological and chemical weapons, if he was attacked. Perhaps that was speculation on the speakers part. And perhaps I'm somewhat nervous, waiting to see what the outcome of this madness will be. You see, I've already used up my supply of duct-tape and plastic, on other household projects. So, I'm sitting here defenseless. It does not give me great comfort that Saddams cousin, "Chemical-Ali" has been placed in charge of the key southern sectors facing US and British troops.[I'm guessing he got that nick-name for a reason] And, I don't care for the sounds of " mobile biological weapons laboratories", [whether or not they violate UN resolutions]This can't be a good thing to have available to a pissed off Iraq leader. |
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America has made all sorts of unverified claims but nothing concrete other than some crappy ass 150mm warheads uncovered in some barn. oh and those al Samoud missles which traveled beyond the specified allowable distance some 25% of the time. but whatever. the US has a historical pattern of lying to its people in times of war. |
And the "mobile biological weapons laboratories" have indeed been found. Iraq says they don't violate UN resolutions. But I still don't think its a good thing to have available to a pissed off leader. [you can go look at the article Tiggy just cited] |
So what? The majority of the American public doesn't want the truth. I saw yesterday on a CNN poll that 51% of the public thinks that Saddam was "personally involved" with 9/11. Is there any proof? Of course not. Does it matter? No. I had a bit of hope before I saw that. But now I don't. We're all screwed. It's not that I'm against the war. On many levels I'm not, though I'm conflicted. None of the reasons the administration have given hold up. But, they don't have to hold up. Most of the American people don't need good arguments, or even bad arguments. It is possible to do the right thing for the wrong reasons, and in the wrong way. In this case I think the long term consequences will be disasterous. |
You will find out what is true and what is not true when this is over. The ships, the mobil labs, the weapons, the torture, the gassing of civilians, the purchases of weapon components from China, France and Germany, all of it. Intelligence has never had the benefit of absolute certainty. Not with Russia, Germany, Al-Queda, or Iraq. Only hindsight tells us just how correct we were in regards to Russia, Germany, and Al-Queda. But as we speak we are closing in on Al-Queda, we are begining the liberation of Iraq, and moving swiftly towards Iran and N Korea. |
There's a difference between "absolute certainty" and "clumsy fabrication." It's kind of like the difference between "US Constitution" and "USA Patriot Act." |
Will you be saying that after world war three? By that time your regret won't mean shit. |
im sorry tiggy....you gotta poll stats on this? i don't believe that one fucking bit. And are you saying we're screwed because of this self-imposed ignorance? i cant believe what you are saying tiggy, czarina. i expect politicians to lie about campaign finances not when it comes to bombing another nation without UN approval, arguably minority American civilian support and even less world support. Im sorry, maybe its just me, but i expect an inkling of integrity from our leaders. i admit to being very confused and upset with what is happening. i wish my baby would come now. |
You don't have a monopoly on outrage or anger. |
Bitch. |
That has never been evident here |
Hurry along then, boy. |
*giggle* duck and cover, bitches. |
yeah. you're right. once they land, they can start planting the evidence. |
...however based on their recent track record, they'll find a way to screw that up too... |
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"For Ms. Walker, Ms. Garafalo, NOW, and every other unconscious and misguided feminist who thinks that removing Saddam is ‘immoral,’ remember Um Haydar is just one of thousands of women who have been raped, tortured and murdered in front of their families. Think of Um’s children, her daughters, whom you have abandoned. Then go to sleep at night and pray to God that the dead can’t really invade your dreams because there are thousands of dead Iraqi women who know how you betray them, in the name of politics, in the name of hating George W. Bush, in the name of your own cynical political hypocrisy." the rape and torture of women in the middle east isn't solely saddam's fault. it's the arab culture's fault. rape of women also happens every minute of every day in the US. |
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you gots to give em at least 48 hours to vacate their homeland because Bush says so. |
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oh for chrissakes it won't take them 48 hours to pack it up and get themselves to Queens. |
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Thank you. |
this one? |
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I'm going to that thread now. I can't believe I was up at 5AM |
Smegma-free diets are all the rage in Hollywood. And we know Dave just has to follow Jennifer Aniston's every bowel movement. |
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It was shorter-lived than I'd hoped. I'm off again. I'll be in touch through Nate or Dave maybe, if either of them can be bothered reading anything I send them. But if Dave tells you that I've gone lesbo or stopped buying shoes worth more than a year's salary or something equally drastic, he's lying. |
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pussy. |
